I’ve gotten in the habit of doing a year-end summary of my creative output, if only to convince myself that I really have accomplished something after all. It’s funny: people have a tendency to react as if I’m boasting, or making the lists to try to make other people feel bad. But for me it’s an emotional survival tool. What have I done? What do I have to show for all the time, energy (and money) I’ve poured into the projects of my heart? Am I putting those resources into things that bring return? The intangible returns are the connections and friendships I make. The unknowable returns are the difference I may have made in other people’s lives. But the only thing I can actually lay out in a blog are the words.
As in previous years, this doesn’t cover the specific calendar year of 2018, but rather picks up after the close of last year’s post which was written on December 12. This year, I’m close enough to the end of the year that I’ll just write it up with the remainder of the year's posts and set it to go live on January 1.
Fiction
In 2018 I had one work of fiction published, and wrote 7 installments on what was intended to be a 25-part serial to promote Jae’s Lesbian Book Bingo challenge. I dropped the serial because of insufficient reader interest. (While I do many projects just for my own enjoyment, when push comes to shove and I have to choose priorities, I’m always more likely to prioritize projects where I have tangible evidence of reader interest. Keep that in mind.) I also finished and polished my novella “The Language of Roses” and sent it off on submission. I sincerely hope that in the 2019 round-up, I’ll have something further to say about it.
Essays
This year there was a drastic drop in how much I blogged outside of the Lesbian Historic Motif Project. Part of that was the increased work being put into the LHMP, part of it was the sense of talking into the void. I honestly don’t know what to do about that. A major part of my social interactions occur online, and blogging has always been part of that. But I'm not into sitting in the corner mubling to myself. In any event, I wrote 5 posts about my own writing projects, participated in 7 guest appearances either as a host or guest, wrote 5 miscellaneous essays, and posted several blogs about the LHMP fiction series. I like doing the random blogs, especially on philosophical topics, but it really does feel like mumbling to myself these days.
Lesbian Historic Motif Project
The vast majority of my non-fiction writing energy was poured into the Lesbian Historic Motif Project. I posted summaries of 62 publications of which 15 were books and the rest individual articles, bringing me up to a grand total of 228 publications for the project. Three of this year's posts involved translation (for which I had support from my very talented friends). Back in the 1990s when I first had thoughts about something like the Project, you never would have convinced me that I could find 228 publications relevant to lesbian history, much less the 600 or so in my master database. I long ago gave up the idea of turning it into some sort of overall synthesis, but in this past year, my mind has been turning back to that idea. I'm starting to think that I might have enough of a grasp on the Big Picture of how lesbian-relevant themes have been understood over time (at least in western Europe) to create something of a road map from all these individual snapshots.
The Podcast maintained its weekly schedule (the links below include 55 shows since the beginning of this summary period was in early December). I interviewed 15 authors or readers, presented 4 original short stories, recorded 13 long-form essays, as well as 9 mini-essays as part of my monthly round-ups, announced 61 new fiction publications of lesbian historical interest, and gave shout-outs to several conferences and podcasts that my listeners might be interested in.
Reviews
On my blog, I reviewed 10 works of fiction with significant lesbian themes, 4 additional works in the SF/F category, 3 books that fall in neither of those (and that weren’t part of the LHMP reading), 2 movie reviews, 1 theater review, and a couple of round-up posts with shorter reviews of tv, movies, and books purchased but not yet read. I posted 36 reviews of short audio fiction at SFF Reviews and then fell off the wagon in...oh dear...April. (Once I get out of the rhythm on a project like that, I get anxiety attacks about getting caught up and the longer I wait, of course the more there is to catch up. I may need to just clear the mental cache and start from an arbitrary new point.) I started reprising some of my book reviews at The Lesbian Review (so, things I also blogged, but in a different format) and posted 11 reviews there.
Events
I once again did my “live-blogging Kalamazoo” posts, summarizing the papers presented in 9 sessions. (I’m not certain I’ll be able to continue this as the Medieval Congress is implementing a new policy about blogging/tweeting sessions and it might involve getting active consent from the speakers -- which is not a bad thing, all in all, but might complicate the logistics too much.) Although I attended my usual number of conventions, I only really blogged reports from 2 of them. (I’m finding that travel wears me out more than it used to, so the post-con travel time when I might otherwise post a summary it a bit more useless these days.)
Summary
So how does all that compare to last year? (Keeping in mind that I shuffle the categories around every year based on what I’m doing.)
All in all, as I noted above, my output has shifted significantly from general blogging (and especially blogging about my writing) to work put into the Lesbian Historic Motif Project, especially the podcast. Is this sustainable? Who can tell? I’ve committed to continuing the podcast in its current format for another year and that will take me through and past my 100th episode, but I can envision deciding to cut back at some point.
Detailed List with Links
Fiction
About My Writing
Guest Blogs (both as host and guest)
Miscellaneous Content
Lesbian Historic Motif Project (Blog)
Lesbian Historic Motif Podcast
Reviews: Books/Fiction - SFF
Reviews: Books/Fiction - Lesbian
Reviews: Other
Convention/Conference Reports
This is a dense and wide-ranging study of lesbian-relevant themes in Indian history, literature, religion, and politics, covering the entire range of history from the earliest written records up through the present day. I'll confess that I'm not familiar enough with the literary and religious traditions to be able to take in a lot of the nuances, but Thadani does a great job of providing both an overview and deep dives within an amazingly compact volume. This is the sort of book that can really only be written from within a culture, as she tackles the ways in which modern Indian nationalism adapted and built on the colonial legacy of misogyny and homophobia for its own purposes. Although the chapters on the experiences of lesbians in modern India come across as fairly depressing, keep in mind that this book was written over 20 years ago. It is foundational, but far from the last or most recent word on the topic.
This post brings 2018 to a close, and it makes a good time to reflect on the state of the Lesbian Historic Motif Project. I'll be including this year's content in my "What Hath She Wrote in 2018" blog that goes up tomorrow, but this is more of a "where have I been and where am I going?" thing.
I started the LHMP in the middle of 2014, and a simple count of the publications covered dodges the fact that sometimes a book has been covered in multiple posts (I think Faderman's Surpassing the Love of Men took the longest with over two dozen separate posts) while other times I've covered a book of similar length in a single blog. But here are the raw statistics:
I've been trying to reconstruct how my "to do" list of publications has grown over that time, but I'm not sure the information can be retrieved. I think that back in 2014 when I first populated my database from the books already in my library it had about 50 books in it. In early 2016, I drew up a "to do" list from the database of material I knew about but hadn't yet covered, which had 177 items listed (some of which were collections that were covered as multiple publications). So if you combine that with the 111 items I'd covered in the blog by then, we get a total of 288. Or, roughly, I'd added 2 titles for every one I blogged. The database currently has a total of 605 titles, so in the last two years I've added a little over 300 and covered 91, for an addition rate of 3 titles for every one I blog. I think you can see where this is going.
Did I know what the potential scope of this project would be when I started? Back in the 1990s when it was only a twinkle in my eye, not only did I not envision how many publications would be available, but most of them literally didn't exist back then. I've recently added a field for "year published" to the database so I could look at the distribution -- although keep in mind that my database contents are far from random or even necessarily representative, given that I tend to add new titles mostly from the bibliographies of existing ones. It isn't necessarily that fewer relevant thing were published in the last decade, but that I may not know about them because they were published after the material I've been blogging recently. It does seem to be true, however that the '90s were a glorious time for works on the history of gender and sexuality!
One of the things I hope to add to the Project in the near future is the beginnings of a synthesis of what I've learned about trends, motifs, and patterns in the expression of lesbian-relevant history. (I've started using "lesbian-relevant" rather than "lesbian-like" in talking about the project because in many ways it better fits the subjective focus on "useable" history for the purposes of creating historical fiction.) One of the more daunting projects is to tackle the complex intertwining of gender and sexuality around the motif of transmasculine expression, especially with an eye to helping authors create historic lesbian characters that employ gender disguise or butch/femme dynamics in ways that don't erase or disparage transgender framings of the same themes. Another daunting project is to create something of a timeline (at least for a European context) of expressions and receptions of female same-sex relations that gives an idea of what types of stories fit well into different historic contexts.
I'm also interested in hearing from readers about what would make the Project more useful to you. Both the tag system and the search function are intended to make it easier to find relevant content, but I'll confess that I'd love to be able to include a multi-factor search (e.g., "16th century AND Germany") which isn't currently possible.
On a separate path, I'm getting closer to massaging my database of lesbian-relevant historical fiction into usability, and by the end of 2019 I hope to be able to present it for others to use in identifying works falling in a particular historic context or with particular themes. (I currently have 430 titles in it and I'm sure that there are large gaps due to the random nature of my current sourcing system, i.e., mostly Goodreads lists and combing through the catalogs of the major lesfic publishers.)
As I'll be explaining in next week's podcast, I'm loosening up the structure of the podcast slightly to include more variety in the mid-month shows, so ideas for podcast content are also welcome and appreciated (including people interested in appearing on the podcast to talk about books or themes).
And that's what I'm thinking about on this New Year's Eve.
Thadani, Giti. 1996. Sakhiyani: Lesbian Desire in Ancient and Modern India. Cassell, London. ISBN 0-304-33452-9
[The following is duplicated from the associated blog. I'm trying to standardize the organization of associated content.]
This is a dense and wide-ranging study of lesbian-relevant themes in Indian history, literature, religion, and politics, covering the entire range of history from the earliest written records up through the present day. I'll confess that I'm not familiar enough with the literary and religious traditions to be able to take in a lot of the nuances, but Thadani does a great job of providing both an overview and deep dives within an amazingly compact volume. This is the sort of book that can really only be written from within a culture, as she tackles the ways in which modern Indian nationalism adapted and built on the colonial legacy of misogyny and homophobia for its own purposes. Although the chapters on the experiences of lesbians in modern India come across as fairly depressing, keep in mind that this book was written over 20 years ago. It is foundational, but far from the last or most recent word on the topic.
# # #
Preface
This book is, in many ways, a political analysis as much as a historic and literary one, tracing the ways in which the “invisibility” of lesbianism in modern India derives not only from defining “lesbian” narrowly as a specific Western phenomenon, but from the influence of male European and Orientalist elements in the study of Indian history to erase woman-centered traditions, in collaboration with Indian nationalist elements that continue the control of the historic narrative by elite men. More recent feminist approaches have challenged this dominance with regard to gender but done little to challenge the heteronormative default.
This book tries to work around those political forces by focusing on desire between women rather than on personal identity. The introductory material includes a glossary of relevant vocabulary from the older texts in order to avoid the necessary blurring of meaning involved in translation or substitution.
Chapter 1: Lesbian Invisibility
The book starts with a concrete example from contemporary times of how female-centered traditions are literally replaced by or converted into male-centered spaces, practices, and deities: the actual re-carving of the statue of a female deity to remove its breasts and other female signifiers, after which it was re-labeled with the name of a male deity.
Thadani identifies multiple examples of overlaying male identity on traditionally female deities and the denial of female divine presence and agency, especially by converting pairs of female divinities to male-female pairs (a god and “his consort”). In other examples, a temple structure where a group of figures or structures representing female divinities had previously surrounded a deliberately open space is re-focused on male presence by placing the statue of a male divinity in the center of the focal space. Thadani documents this as an ongoing modern process even affecting sites that are theoretically protected as of historic significance. Another approach is for images with obviously feminine characteristics to be described in official literature as masculine. There is a long tradition of independent female deities being appropriated as male or converted into the “consort” of a male deity.
Hindu nationalism has invested in the artificial construction of a homogenized and monolithic Hinduism (historically, in reaction to and as a bulwark against invasions by Islamic and European cultures). This monolithic structure necessarily erases the traditions of independent female deities. And the selective editing of older religious traditions has systematically reconstructed “Indian tradition” as monolithically heterosexual. Thadani presents a structural discussion of how patriarchal assumptions impose patriarchal conclusions on otherwise neutral data.
Indian nationalism promoted the view that homosexuality was an invasive tradition by external “others”: Greek, Islamic, European. This attitude also erased traditional concepts of a plural-gendered self which allowed for myriad gender interactions.
Historical and philosophical arguments are structured to frame desire as always for the “other”--a position that presumes that women can only worship a male god and that goddess traditions can only be viewed via the mediation of a male worshipper or male deity. Even Tantric traditions that emphasize a merging of male and female within the self present the process from a male point of view.
Thadani discusses whether the word “lesbian” is appropriate to use in exploring earlier Indian history, but settles on claiming the term “lesbian” as a political choice--not as an identity, but as an experience of desire. She uses the image of Kali standing on the corpse of Shiv as a symbol of women rejecting submissive subordination. But this image also represents the difficulty of trying to create a unified Hindu tradition without conflict over, and erasure of, the essentially contradictory traditions that appear in the source material.
This book works chronologically through various historic traditions, showing how they interacted and evolved. There is a discussion of key points of linguistics that manifest in how deities are identified. One key process is creating masculine forms of feminine terms that appropriate the underlying concept as masculine. The generic feminine is expressed in grammatically plural or dual forms, indicating different aspects of the goddess. But dual forms (especially in translation) get reinterpreted as masculine singular terms. Another process is for word roots that are not inherently gendered, but can be expressed in either masculine or feminine forms, to be converted into an inherently masculine word root that then is feminized via suffixes. This results in a linguistic “male default with subordinate feminine forms” rather than equivalent male and female derivatives. [Note: To envision what Thadani is talking about here, think about all the agentive nouns in English where the root form defaults to male and the female form is created by adding “-ess”, although there has been an effective movement to address this issue--poet/poetess, actor/actress, steward/stewardess.]
Chapter 2: The Dual Feminine
[Note: The earliest written literature from India are the Vedic hymns--religious texts in an early form of Sanskrit.]
The earliest written records are not “original” in any meaningful sense but reflect complex, contradictory layers of tradition. Earlier cosmologies can only be approximated by identifying patterns and discontinuities in the material. Thadani references Marija Gimbutas’s theory of a shift from gynefocal to patriarchal societies around 4000 BCE. [Note: Gimbutas was an archaeologist and anthropologist focusing on Neolithic and Bronze Age cultures in Europe. The theory referenced here is not universally accepted.] “Excavating” earlier traditions fromt he Rig Veda (as the collection of Vedic hymns are collectively known) requires recognizing that it doesn’t represent a coherent system.
Later interpretations projected a pattern of subservient female consorts to male deities, but that pattern fractures when the material is analyzed in detail. Traces of earlier, independent feminine symbologies are still present, in particular in the form of female divine pairs in contrast to male-female pairs. These dual feminine figures are not “lesbian” as a whole, but can include lesbian-relevant figures.
The dual feminine is the basis for feminine genealogies in the Vedic traditions--part of a continuum of female-female bonds and relationships that can’t be reduced to sexual encounters.
Thadani explores one motif-group associated with the figure of Usha: a female symbol of light, imagined as a complex woven structure. Contrasts of dark-light and stillness-movement are transformed continuously one to the other, not set up in binary opposition. They are represented by dual sisters sharing the same space. Key terminology of this representation includes jami (twins, though not necessarily implying biological relationship), dyava (dual female deities), and language implying union, togetherness, kissing, as well as the image of dual mothers. Dyava comes from the dual feminine linguistic form of dya (light). The full dual is dyavau and the root dyava implies a single unit with dual identity. This divine female pair can be seen as lovers, mothers, or sisters. In this era, divine pairs are not identified as male-female pairs but as same-sex jami (twins), either male or female.
The dual female deity comes together with the earth as a feminine generative unit, creating various patterns of female genealogy. The Rig Veda includes many dual feminine divinities, especially Usha and Nakta, representing the revolving/shifting change of existence, not as a binary opposition but as a continuous alternation. Within this cosmology, humanity (both female and male) is generated from a female pair who give birth without being impregnated and are both mothers. Social structures based on this cosmology involve kinship based on collective motherhood. Specific instances of female-female relationships in the Vedas include paired mothers, mother-daughter pairs, or paired yuvati (lovers). The pervasive term jami (twin) doesn’t necessarily indicate biological twins but the idea of a linked, equal couple.
Poetic imagery often involves sacred animals, such as pairs of cows sharing the nurturing of a calf, or paired mares.
[Note: Thadani goes into a fair amount of technical detail on linguistic derivations of terms, such as specific words for “sister”. While I haven’t had time to follow up on this in detail, I’m reserving judgment on the linguistic validity of the derivations, as opposed to these being traditional etymologies in the extensive Sanskrit linguistic literature.]
Jami sexuality is seen as a flowing together, a fusing of diverse streams, a transformation as a result of joining. Mother-daughter symbolism is more extensive than simple biological kinship. There is extensive symbolism using the erotics of breast-centered fecundity, milk as life/nourishment. Womb symbolism includes caves, tides, and regeneration.
Female dualities interact with Earth to generate a third space: a material fertility embodied as the revolving alternation of the dyad and the material force that drives them.
[Note: OK, that’s a lot of general imagery, summarized by me very superficially. This is a complex and detailed text and the best I can do is give you an impressionistic idea of it.
Chapter 3: The Myths of Usha and Urvashi
This chapter uses the female pair Usha and Urvashi to illustrate the shift to a male-centered cosmology. It opens with a hymn depicting the male god Indr overthrowing, defeating, and raping the light-goddess Usha. This can be seen as embodying the disruption of an earlier worldview of movement-fluidity, and imposing the image of a directional defeat of one force over its polar opposite, rather than a continuous alternation. Similarly disruptive imagery is seen in myths of the killing of the goddess Danu and her son, which is presented as “heroic deeds.”
Concrete imagery in these hymns includes splitting mountains, possessing bodies of water, killing feminine deities and sybols, penetration and violent victory. Light is depicted as a conqueror of darkeness rather than an alternation. Diversity becomes opposition. The focus shifts to semen as a generative force and a system of binary opposition, culture versus nature, sacrifice as the basis of creativity.
Rather than Usha being the dual-feminine “daughter of light” she is changed into primarily being a mother of sons. Divine female figures who cannot be attached to male deities as adjuncts are literally “demonized.”
The tension between matrifocal and patriarchal society continues to play out in the mythic material, as illustrated by the myth of Urvashi and Pururvas. Urvashi “the expansive one” is a water goddess. Pururvas is the mortal son of the goddess Ida (born without reference to a father figure). This tradition includes the earliest known reference to the root shiva (a feminine form, and appearing prior to masculine use).
Pururvas is depicted as raping and impregnating Urvashi, who berates him for acting against the feminine cosmology. Urvashi maintains her unobtainable essence--the immortality Pururvas desires to obtain from her--and he is condemned to mortality. Pururvas demands that the Ushas (the dual-feminine deity) offer their benefits to the patriarchal family, while Urvashi rejects the supposedly claiming act of rape/penetration. Urvashi’s natural state of immortal existence is in contrast to Pururvas’s “other/beyond” state, representing death. In contrast, the patriarchal world that Pururvas attempts to claim her for is “exile” to Urvashi. (That is, this is the symbolic language used in their dialogues.)
In later versions of the story, rather than this conflict being presented as a dialogue between Urvashi and Pururvas, a male narrator is inserted into the story who takes over presenting Urvashi’s voice. In that version, Urvashi’s departure from the patriarchal arrangement, which results in the ego-death of Pururvas (death and immortality) is re-interpreted as a “rescue” by other forces rather than a self-rejection.
The story involves a complicated symbolism of death/separation (Nirriti) imagined as a passage between lives or worlds, the “beyond”. This image became linked to female desire and sexual fluidity as contrasted to “virility/manhood.” “Virile” sexuality was focused only on reproduction, not as an experience of desire. Nirriti is framed as an anti-virile, feminizing force. This view of sexuality automatically excludes ecstatic experiences and same-sex sexuality in the jami mode, which latter comes to stand for any non-procreative sexuality.
Chapter 4: The Control of Lesbian Sexuality
(In the middle of this chapter, we have a selection of photos of art--sculpture and painting of a variety of eras--depicting sexual activity between women or illustrating some of the mythic material discussed in the text.)
In mythological stories, ascetic mysticism represented a tension between male chastity and female sexuality, with the latter represented by an unconsorted female deity living among a community of women. This uncontrolled, free female sexual energy was contrasted with the “dharmic” ascetic man. His abstinence was fear of the feminine erotic. His only approved purpose for sexuality was the production of male offspring. Outside of that purpose, sexual desire was impurity and a weakening force.
Theology structured the world as a male (by definition) lord and his domain, which was represented in female terms. Within this system, there is no place for female self-determination and will. The female aspect represented material nature, the lower, earthly aspect of the world. This contrasts with the earlier gynefocal cosmology. This shift is also established via legal, medical, and mythic texts.
Dharma -- “right conduct” -- was defined in specifically patriarchal terms. The parameters were established in philosophical literature around the 5th century BCE through the 2nd or 3rd century CE.
Legal texts established the heterosexual family as the only recognized mode of kinship. Caste boundaries were enforced. During this era, laws against lesbian sexuality were established, focusing on the potential for sex between women to destroy virginity or for the potential of sexual initiation of a younger woman by an older one. For example, one text gives two relevant laws: if a virgin (kanya) has sex with another virgin, she pays twice the bride price to the other’s father and is beaten. If a woman (stri) deflowers a virgin, her head is shaved or two fingers cut off and she is publicly shamed.
The emphasis here is on “virginity” as a commodity under the patriarchal marriage economy, for which a father must be compenated. The question arises, in the first case of two virgins, who is the “active” partner who is viewed as the perpetrator? The language itself does not require an asymmetric act and could cover non-penetrative activities as well as penetrative ones. The emphasis is on the concept of “deflowering” but can include self-penetration or non-vaginal sex. Legal commentaries suggest interpretations such a assigning the perpetrator role to the woman of higher caste. There is an emphasis on women’s inability to legally consent to sex or to control her own sexuality. Women are not supposed to be sexually initiated by another woman, only by a husband within marriage.
Inter-caste and adulterous relationships are also prohibited, illustrating the overall system’s focus on restricting sexuality to approved marriage pairings. Non-procreative sex of any type is disparaged.
Within marriage, medical literature provides detailed rules and instructions for how to perform approved types of procreative sex for the desired effect (a healthy male child). This same literature provides catalogs of types of sexual “defects” that either prevent achieving this desired effect or are the result of improper sexual behavior. This includes various categories of male homosexuality, as well as the claim that sex between two women will produce a boneless fetus. (These descriptions, however, provide specific descriptions of sexual acts between women, such as “when one woman...mounts another woman like a man and rubs herself against the other woman.” A tendency toward lesbian sex is identified as an “illness” of the vagina due to improper sex at conception or to embryonic damage due to defective gametes. Lesbians are conflated with the inability to beget children in the epithets applied to them: man-hater, breastless, incapable of menstruation, possessing no ovum. But at the same time, medical literature of this era considers it possible for a woman to impregnate another woman via the clitoris which is recognized as a penis-analog. (The most famous example of this scenario is in the birth of Bhagirath from the sexual union of two women.)
Medical terminology distinguished the procreative yoni from the external genitalia (bhag) relevant to sexual pleasure. Thus a verb indicating sex between women sambhog, which is found in one version of the Ramayan in which the god Ganesh is born from the union of the queens Chandra and Mala. Variants of this motif occur in other stories, often involving the co-wives of a dead king producing an heir for him after his death. Mythic versions often include motifs of water deities where the merging of bodies of water symbolizes sex.
(This chapter includes extensive details of sexual theology that are difficult to summarize, as well as an extensive list of divine names and attributes that incorporate the element bhag.)
The cosmology involving rigid structures around caste, gender, and sexuality were revised with the (re)introduction of a divine feminine principle, shakti. This provided an opportunity for older female divinities that had been converted into consorts of male deities to return to an autonomous state in which the concept of procreative sex was inverted or subverted. (Various mythic/heroic stories involving autonomous female figures who disrupt patriarchal expectations are discussed.) These stories also include sex-change motifs, as when two kings pledge that their not-yet-born offspring will marry, only to have both children be girls, with the conflict resolved at some point via magical sex-change. Some stories, however, resist a heteronormative resolution, as in the tale of Brahmani and Ratnavati which concludes with the two women spending their lives together as a couple.
Chapter 5 - Legacies of Colonialism
This chapter covers the effects, not only on gender and sexuality cultures in India, but on knowledge about historic cultures, from the colonial legacy that erased “disapproved” cultures or imposed new interpretations on them that adhered to western views of gender and sexuality. Gender politics played a role in how colonizing powers legitimated their own actions (e.g., “rescuing” downtrodden Indian women). Even modern social historians trying to reconstruct older structures too often valorize variant and androgynous traditions of masculinity while ignoring or demonizing variant or androgynous women. In the case of India, the latter often invokes the “Kali spectrum” of non-consorted goddesses.
Both colonial appropriation and Indian nationalist movements had a stake in focusing on the “Aryan heritage” that privileged the patriarchal Vedic, brahmanic and kshatriya traditions. And both movements collaborated on relegating women to be the keepers of tradition and those responsible for managing sexuality. The woman-focused shakti traditions were ignored or appropriated as consorts of male figures. Female independence, education, and self-realization were framed as being due to western materialism, in contrast to the self-sacrifice, chastity, and maternal devotion expected of women by nationalist movements. The existing mythic and religious traditions are sifted through for female imagery that supports and emphasizes these themes, discarding traditions that contradict it. This theme is expanded on at some length with examples.
Thadani then turns to the fate of marginalized woman-focused traditions in this era. For example, the cult of Sakhibhavas, those who worshipped Radha (often presented as the female lover of Krishna) as devoted female friends (sakhis) of Radha. Sakhi was one of the forms of bonding between women that included an erotic aspect. The Sakhibhava cult included male participants who expressed their devotion to Radha through a feminine identity. The core principle of Sakhbhava was a woman-woman fusion that can be categorized as lesbian. This movement diverged from the tradition of the Krishna-Radha romance approved in the dominant canon, though the Purana literature includes references to Kali kissing Radha that can be seen as part of the alternate tradition. From this point of view, the Krishna-Radha story can be seen as a man (Krishna) intruding into a female-inhabited space and forcibly making himself its center.
There is a discussion of how the canonical Krishna-Radha story imposed gendered interpretations on traditional religious dance and even created a template for pop culture depictions of courtship and romance that centered on the agressive pursuit by an entitled male figure of an "innocent" independent and disinterested woman whose sexuality is awaked by his successful pursuit.
The division of female expressions of gender and sexuality in terms of motherhood into the “good mother” and the “bad/destroying/consuming mother” required absorbing even the pre-Vedic non-consorted non-material apsara deities into this binary division, requiring all such figures to be “bad mothers.” There’s a discussion of how this imagery was used in some takes on Indian psycho-sexual analysis. Examples are given at some length and how it affects the cultural expectations for both boys and girls as they mature.
Despite the cultural expectation in modern India of homosocial spaces, there is a lack of language to describe and emphasize woman-woman sexual and kinship structures. There are no contexts for independent female goddesses or cosmolgonies. Outside of the patriarchal, monotheistic traditions of Christianity and Islam, the Hindu tradition is built entirely on a deliberately male-centered reconstruction of older traditions into a monolithic patriarchal religion. Words that in earlier ages carried sexual meaning or invoked a female-oriented worldview, such as bhagini, sakhi, jami have been stripped of those senses to mean simply “sister”, “female friend” and the like. The words shanda/shandali are translated in male-centered terms as indicating a masculinized woman or an unfeminine woman, not as a woman-desiring woman. Neutral words for “lesbian” are generally new coinages that literally translate words such as “homosexual.” Only in rare cases does an academic historical dictionary allow for the contextual meaning of these words in shaktic traditions.
The British colonial imposition of anti-sodomy laws in India did not explicitly include lesbian sex (as it was not explicitly included in the original British laws) but were worded in such a way that it could be (and was) applied to lesbianism. (“Carnal intercourse against the order of nature with any ... woman...”) Colonial sex-related laws were not discarded by post-colonial India but rather adapted to the purposes and goals of nationalist gender ideology. In the case of lesbians, reaction against the concept of women having a sexual life independent of male control, combined with a definition of masculinity focused on procreation, creates a hostile climate that assails both lesbian relationships and relationships including a transmasculine partner.
A number of anecdotes and new articles are presented giving the context for modern attitudes towards same-sex sexuality in the later 20th century, but on an official level and within the family.
Chapter 6 - Westernization
Further examples and discussion of lesbian images and experiences in contemporary India.
Chapter 7 - Love and Death
This chapter discusses various motifs of female lovers in traditional and modern literature, and how those affect individual expectations and behavior, including a significant rate of suicide among lesbian couples who see no other option.
Folk tales (and the older mythic tales they evolved from) include stories of marriage between women, typically due to the vow by two fathers that their not-yet-born children will wed. When both are born girls, perhaps one is raised semi-secretly as a boy in order to fulfill the vow. After the marriage, the women discover the truth of their gender, as well as recognizing their love for each other. In the older tales, this would typically be resolved with a magical sex change, but in a more modern folk tale (Teeja and Beeja), they instead leave home together to seek their fortune in the world. After adventures and an attempt to return home (and including a magical sex-change, after all, that doesn’t work as intended as is reversed), they live happily together as women.
This resolution was possible in the older religious traditions that included mystical unions that did not require particular gender roles. But when those traditions have been invoked in modern India (examples are given) the concept is rejected. Indeed, arguments for woman-woman spiritual unions have sometimes resulted in backlash against emotional bonds between women in general. An example is given of a rural tradition of a formal “friendship pact” (maitri karar) that had a long traditional history being used to formalize women’s unions, but that such traditions were beginning to be regarded negatively.
Even more than the often arbitrary application of laws, the greatest barrier to women’s romantic relationships is familial rejection (or, more often, coercion into heterosexual marriage, including by violence, or even murder of one or both partners).
Chapter 8 - Lesbian Identities
This chapter discusses the difficulties for women in modern India to construct lesbian identities.
Lesbian Historic Motif Podcast - Episode 86 (previously 29e) - At the Mouth by Gurmika Mann - transcript
(Originally aired 2018/12/29 - listen here)
Welcome to the fourth story in the Lesbian Historic Motif Podcast original fiction series! I’ve been so happy with the response to the fiction series and I’ve been delighted to be able to do my part to put more lesbian historical fiction out into the world. As you already know if you’re a regular listener, I’ll be running a second fiction series in 2019. Submissions will be open for the month of January. Check out the link in the show notes if you think you have something we might be interested in.
Our author, Gurmika Mann, is a queer Punjabi-Canadian woman living in Alberta. She studied English Literature and Psychology at McGill University. When she isn't writing, she loves picking apart narratives in pop culture - especially in TV, movies and video games. Her interest in historical culture, religion and mythology is reflected in her first published piece, "At the Mouth". You can follow her on twitter: @gikhee.
Our narrator, Maya Chhabra, is a poet and fiction writer whose work has appeared in Abyss & Apex, Mythic Delirium, and The Cascadia Subduction Zone, among other venues. Her novella Toxic Bloom is forthcoming from Falstaff Press, and her novelette Walking on Knives is available from Less Than Three Press. Her translation from the Russian of Marina Tsvetaeva's Fortune was published in Cardinal Points, Volume 8. She can be found on twitter @mayachhabra.
I’ll have links for both our author and narrator in the show notes.
This recording is released under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-NoDerivatives 4.0 International Public License. You may share it in the full original form but you may not sell it, you may not transcribe it, and you may not adapt it.
At the Mouth
by
Gurmika Mann
Ramya was the one who told her after morning prayers. “The old ladies were saying Jaya is getting married to Raju.” They were sweeping the temple courtyard together before old man Balaji told them to come inside and begin their practice.
Aayushi squinted. “Raju’s father owns their house.”
“Of course he does. He owns half this temple too.” Ramya clicked her tongue. “You’re so slow.”
“Jaya wouldn’t want to marry him,” said Aayushi, hiking up her sari to lean over, sweeping along the far wall of the courtyard. They were getting closer to the gate, both of them managing to push along an ever-growing pile of dust, grains, rice, and flower petals that had scattered from the morning prayers. “Tell Balaji I’m going out. I ripped a seam in my blouse.”
“You’re full of shit,” said Ramya, but she was grinning. “Get one of those sweets next to Jaya’s house.”
“You’re always eating!” Aayushi scolded, pushing open the gates of the temple and hurriedly sweeping the threshold clean. She dropped her broom at Ramya’s feet, smoothed out her sari, and dashed away from the temple, following the downhill path into the village.
###
Kargal wasn’t a big village but it boasted a temple devoted to Indra with six devadasis paying homage to the deity along with a dozen brahmin that oversaw the complex. The temple was situated at the open mouth of a river, and the jungle spread around it, lush and thick. As Aayushi picked her way down the path from the temple gate to the main road of the village, the thunderous roar of the river began to fade out behind her, replaced now by the clamour of voices as the village got on with yet another day of business.
Aayushi passed the sweets shop first where Nandini wrapped up two maladus and then snuck an extra for her as she pointed to the open window of Jaya’s shop. “Did you hear she’s getting married?”
“No, she’s not,” said Aayushi before bidding her goodbye and crossing the road, into the open door of the clothes shop. There was already incense burning near the open windowsill of the shop, and Aayushi thought of kicking it over.
“Aayushi,” said Jaya from behind her.
Aayushi startled. “You scared me!”
Jaya laughed, her smile wide and her eyes crinkling. “If I can scare you, then you must be feeling off.”
“I’m fine,” she said. Jaya was wearing a green sari today, folded impeccably over her waist, the long piece coming over her shoulder elegantly, naturally. Her hair was in a long, black braid as usual, but there were flowers - small and white - tucked just behind her ear. When Jaya limped past her, Aayushi could smell the incense lingering on her skin. It was awful.
“So you are getting married.”
Jaya’s home was covered in fabrics - wool, cotton, silk - all dyed in bright colours, but still uncut and unembroidered. From the entrance all the way to the back, Aayushi could see the piles of neatly folded clothes, all carefully arranged by shades. She had been here when customers came in, watched how the new brides immediately crouched near the reds next to the windowsill, and the mourners who arrived would go to the pile of untouched whites near the back door. Aayushi always loved green, and Jaya kept it against the wall next to the red, said that’s where the devadasis liked to linger and gossip as they watched the new brides fret over which shade would suit them best.
“To Raju,” said Jaya as she limped out through the door into the back courtyard where Aayushi knew was her small stove. “He’s the only who didn’t ask for a dowry.”
“Your house is his dowry.”
With Jaya no longer in her sight, Aayushi pressed a fist against her stomach, willing the pressure to ease, but all she felt was a hopeless terror. Slowly, she made her way past the clothes into courtyard, where there was a cot under the shade, next to a stovetop and dishes.
Jaya was already seated on the cot, her bad leg propped along the length of the cot, as she busied herself portioning out water in two cups to make tea. The briquettes in her stove burnt hot, and Aayushi could smell the incense here too. It made her grimace as she crouched down next to Jaya. “Jaya…”
“I finished your sari for the next full moon,” said Jaya, not looking up while she poured the water from the cups into a pot. “It’s blue and gold. I sewed bells on the edges of the sleeves for when you dance.” She placed the pot on the flat clay of the stove and began to stoke the briquettes with a long stick.
“Don’t marry Raju,” said Aayushi softly. Her hands were fisted in the skirt of her orange sari, the colour reminding her too much of the fresh marigold garlands Jaya would have to wear at her wedding.
“I put flowers all along the hem of the skirt. The white ones you like that grow near the river.”
“Jaya,” said Aayushi, a little more loudly, desperately.
The water was slowly beginning to bubble. “Your blouse is silk, even though you asked for cotton, but it will match. I put in hooks at the sides in case you get fat with maladus before you put it on.”
The joke had Aayushi laughing, surprising herself, before looking up at Jaya. Jaya was moving to put in the tea leaves into her boiling water, a pinch of fennel and two pieces of crushed clove. Aayushi usually left by now to get goat’s milk from Nandini to use for the tea, but instead she felt stuck here, watching Jaya’s face, how Jaya refused to look at her even as she spoke.
“And there’s fish. On the shoulders.” Jaya sighed as she watched the water darken from the tea leaves and spices, letting out a smell that was much more comforting to Aayushi than the incense. “They’re climbing up against the waterfall, trying… trying to touch you.”
It was the way Jaya’s jaw was clenched so tight... Aayushi couldn’t help herself; she reached out, cupped Jaya’s cheek in her palm, and it was so easy and so familiar. Jaya leaned into the touch for just a moment before pulling away to lift the pot off the stove. There was no milk.
“I can get some from Nandini.”
Jaya shook her head. “I can drink it like this. Do you still…?”
“Yes, I’ll have some too.”
Carefully, Jaya poured the tea out into two cups, and poured some fresh water inside of the pan so the tea leaves would float instead of getting stuck along the inside. “I have no choice.”
Aayushi winced. Holding the cup meant she couldn’t hold Jaya, and the distance seemed immeasurable at that moment - with her on one side of Jaya’s cot and Jaya on the other, Jaya’s bad leg between them, tucked under the long green sari.
“I knew,” started Jaya, still not looking at her, “I knew you wouldn’t understand.”
“You don’t have to,” she said, staring at the unfinished chai in her hands.
“Raju didn’t ask for a dowry and he doesn’t mind my leg.”
“I don’t mind your leg either!” Aayushi stared up at her, hopeless. “Just because his father gave you a storefront after your parents died doesn’t mean you need to marry his son!”
Jaya reeled back, and her heavy brows drew together in anger. “I made you that sari for you to seduce some rich brahmin, Aaya. You will marry too. This - whatever this is - isn’t forever.”
“But you don’t want it!”
“It’s not about what I want!” Jaya’s shoulders were drawn tight and Aayushi couldn’t help remembering when she would massage them, knowing exactly how warm Jaya’s skin was under her touch, how she always grew so tense as she worked deep into the night to get her embroidery perfect on her saris. “It’s… It’s what’s required.”
Her small mouth was turned down at the corners. Aayushi wanted to kiss her. “Let’s run away to Bengalore, where the rajput lives.” Jaya stared at her, but Aayushi continued, unhindered. “We’ll join his harem, and be like Ravana’s wives, who kissed each other when he couldn’t kiss them.”
Jaya’s expression was soft with affection, but still she seemed so far away. “Silly Aaya.” She gestured to the house. “This isn’t a story. I am going to make more saris for you - when you’re married and when you’re pregnant and when you dance for Indra with the other devadasis. And you’re going to bless my marriage as the nitya sumangali and you’ll dance for Indra to not pass on this leg to my children.”
Before she could stop herself, Aayushi began to cry. “Just tell me what you want first.”
“I…” Looking at her hands, Jaya shook her head. “I want to prove I’m the best - at clothes, at embroidery, at sewing. I want to show everyone I can get by with this leg.”
“How?”
“By getting married for money,” said Jaya, rolling her eyes. “Really, Aaya.”
“Okay.” Aayushi wiped at her face, cleaning her tears, before putting the chai down and standing up. “I’ll give you money.”
“Aayushi!” Jaya snapped. “I don’t need your charity!”
“But I’m a devadasi - I have money. I can give you money.”
“The rest of us aren’t like you!” She shouted, startling Aayushi for a moment. Sucking in a deep breath, Jaya seemed to regain her composure, but her entire frame shimmered with anger. “The rest of us can’t live like a carefree child like you. The rest of us have responsibilities.”
“I’m not a child,” said Aayushi, stung. She was twenty, a fully-fledged devadasi, who knew the sacred dances and could sing Lord Indra’s praises. “But I’m not so scared to hide behind a some man instead of seeing I could be something more.”
“I knew you wouldn’t understand,” said Jaya, her voice flat, her gaze turning cold. “How could a child understand anything of an adult woman’s reality.”
The words felt like a physical blow. Aayushi stepped back, incomprehending for a moment. Still, Jaya sat there, her back straight, her dark eyes under her heavy brows meeting Aayushi’s as if to challenge her. She didn’t want Aayushi there. Aayushi didn’t want to be there anymore either.
She left, leaving her unfinished chai behind, and returned to the temple.
###
Before the full moon, the women in Kargal had fasted all day and arrived just after sundown at the temple for blessings of longevity and happy marriage and healthy children. Aayushi and Ramya had been busy all day with preparations - cooking and decoration and cleaning the temple along with the other devadasis - before Balaji and the other brahmins had summoned them to dance in the courtyard. As the crowd of women gathered to pay respects to Indra and the moon, Aayushi danced the familiar steps, listening to the cheers and claps from the audience, and was grateful it was over soon. She needed to find Nandini’s mother.
Though the majority of the village crowd were women, Aayushi saw some of the landowning men talking to the brahmins. Balaji was with Raju’s father, but Aayushi couldn’t spot Raju himself. She knew Jaya didn’t like making the walk to the temple in the evening where it was hard to see where to step with her bad leg. Instead, she usually sent her offerings with Nandini, who Aayushi finally spotted standing next to the statue of Indra, where the smoke from the burning incense wafted around her moon-round face. Her mother was next to her, and Aayushi ducked around the other devadasis to talk to them.
“Aaya!” Nandini’s mother was just as large and soft as the maladus her family sold. Aayushi bowed to touch her feet, bracing herself for the conversation to follow. “Jaya sent me up with her sari for you. The rajput’s sons are coming to Kargal for the winter solstice?”
“I wanted to look my best for them,” said Aayushi. “Did Raju come?”
“He’s somewhere around here.”
“He’s marrying Jaya.”
Nandini’s mother beamed. “She’s twenty-two, it’s overdue. And Raju is a good boy. His family is going to pay, so Jaya doesn’t have to worry about a thing. Now we just have to find a boy for you next.”
“And offend my true husband Indra-dev?” Aayushi relaxed as Nandini and her mother both laughed. Nandini crouched down next to the basket they had brought and got out of the silk sari for Aayushi.
“For you.”
Aayushi thanked her as she held the silk, feeling it slip between her fingers. “Jaya is only getting married for money.”
Immediately, Nandini’s mother clicked her tongue. “That’s not how women speak, Aayushi.”
“But it’s true,” insisted Aayushi, having braced herself all day for this conversation. “She wants to continue being a seamstress, but she thinks getting married is the only way she can keep doing that.”
“Aaya,” said Nandini quietly. “It took a long time for my ama to secure this match.”
Aayushi gripped onto the sari to keep it from sliding out from her arms. “We can - I can - help her. She doesn’t have to do this. She’s skilled enough to make double what she does now, but she lives in Kargal, not Siddapur or Sagar.”
Nandini’s mother shook her head, one soft hand cupping Aayushi’s cheek. “But that is not how women live, Aaya. Jaya said the same thing but she understands now what must be done.”
The topic was clearly too uncomfortable for Nandini’s mother as she soon moved away to go talk to the other older women. Nandini stood next to her basket of offerings, reaching out to snag one of Aayushi’s bangles on a finger and tugging her closer.
“Ama had to argue with Jaya day and night too.” Nandini’s face was cast half in shadow, and her chin tilted downwards, saddened. “But we don’t have any money for Jaya to borrow and Raju was there.”
“What if I gave her money?” Aayushi asked suddenly, turning towards her, the sari clutched tightly to her chest. “Then what?”
“Then nothing,” said Nandini, shrugging. “Jaya would still get married. It’s not about money anymore, Aaya. It’s just… what’s done.”
“But she doesn’t want it!”
“We have no choice!” Nandini didn’t raise her voice but she stared wide-eyed and imploring at Aayushi before looking away, embarrassed. “I mean, me and Jaya. You’re a devadasi. You are already married to a dev.”
Aayushi looked at Nandini’s finger still caught around her bangle on her wrist and felt so, so tired. “I’m a woman too.”
“Yes,” said Nandini, letting go of the bangle now. “But you’re not like us.”
###
The winter solstice would be coming in less than one full moon’s turn. Jaya would get married then, just before the rajput’s arrival here with his sons on his tour to see the temples. In the meantime, Aayushi tried on the new sari in her room with Ramya within the temple. Ramya clicked her tongue when she saw the embroidery was missing on one corner of the hem.
“You pay this girl for incomplete work?”
Aayushi smacked her arm but frowned. “She’s never done this before.” Changing back into her other sari, she carefully folded the blue silk back up. “I should get it fixed.”
“Don’t come back crying like last time,” said Ramya, waving goodbye.
Aayushi mustered a smile as if to reassure but felt it fade away as she left the temple to make her way into the village proper. The days beforehand, she had Ramya sell off a few of her jewellery in exchange for coin when the brahmins had sent them down for grocery shopping. Now, Aayushi had a small heavy purse full of coin that she tucked between the folds of the blue sari, and she could only hope Jaya would even see her much less accept her… her charity.
Still, Aayushi had to try.
The sweets storefront was being managed by Nandini’s little brother this time. He waved to Aayushi as she crossed the road to Jaya’s home. Swallowing down her anxiety, Aayushi stepped past the threshold, to be surrounded and swallowed by the piles of fabrics around her. Jaya was sitting near the open window, sewing the edges of a blouse together. Her bad leg was stretched out in front of her with a blanket thrown overtop, and her sari this time was coloured a pale yellow like the small flowers that dotted the path between the village and temple. Her rough, worked hands held the needle delicately as she sewed, her head bent downwards in concentration, her thick dark hair braided in a neat plait as usual. Standing there watching, Aayushi could recall how it felt when her fingers had carded through Jaya’s hair, how it felt like the earth after it had rained - so soft, so heavy. She could even remember the touch of Jaya’s calloused fingers, even as Aayushi massaged oil and butter into the skin to soften it, scolding her for working too hard.
“Jaya,” she called out. Immediately, Jaya jerked in surprise, head snapping up in attention. She had been so focused that she hadn’t even heard Aayushi come in.
“Aaya,” Jaya said, still clearly surprised.
“The sari,” started Aayushi before the words died away in her mouth.
Jaya looked down finally to see Aayushi holding the blue silk before gesturing for her to put it down next to Jaya. “Is there a mistake? Let me look.”
Aayushi handed the silk over, and Jaya’s precise fingers unfolded the length of it with an ease and familiarity that Aayushi wondered anyone else could imitate. It only took a few moments for the coin purse to fall out into Jaya’s lap as she spread the silk and Jaya paused, looking down. Immediately, Aayushi could feel all her awkward laughter and excuses pile behind her teeth, trying to come out, to pretend this never happened. This was a youth’s indulgence; Jaya would get married and Aayushi would continue to get her clothes done by her, and Aayushi’s frantic attempts to seemingly save Jaya would just be a pebble in the stream of their lives together.
Except Jaya didn’t look twice at the coin purse. She found the corner with the missing embroidery instead. “I haven’t done this before.”
“You haven’t,” agreed Aayushi eventually. “That’s why I had to come see you.”
Jaya looked up, a faint smile on her mouth. “That’s the only reason? Come, sit.”
Helpless, Aayushi sat down next to Jaya’s bad leg, sliding the palms of her hands over the ocean of silk spread between them. “I liked the fish on the blouse.”
“I’m glad.” Jaya put down her needle and thread for the other blouse and focused on the sari. “I can’t wait to see you dance in this.”
“You only ever come to the temple when I’m wearing something of yours.”
Jaya grinned, shameless. Aayushi couldn’t stop herself from staring at how beautiful Jaya was in this moment, looking perfectly at ease and content with her life, bantering with Aayushi as if this was any other day. As if there wasn’t a fat coin purse sitting right in her lap.
“Jaya…”
“If I take this purse,” interrupted Jaya, looking up at her from beneath her heavy brows. “If I take it, then I can never come back.”
“I…” A part of Aayushi wanted to be confident, wanted to say, “yes, of course, I knew that,” but no part of her was ready. She thought back to Nandini and her round face, her large imploring eyes. Isn’t this what she meant? That girls like Nandini and Jaya would always have to cave to the wants of the village - married off with their own aspirations relegated to the dusty corners of the courtyard. “I don’t want you to leave.”
“If I stay, I get married.”
“I don’t want you to get married either.”
Jaya sighed. “Then what do you want, Aaya? Silly girl.”
Fiddling with the silk, Aayushi looked out the window of the storefront. “I want you to be happy.”
“I’m happy with you.”
“No, you’re not.” Aayushi turned back towards Jaya. “You’re happiest… when you work. And I make you the happiest when I can show your work off.”
She doesn’t expect Jaya to reach out, her familiar rough hands cupping Aayushi’s palms. “You…” Her face was tipped down now, and Aayushi could see her long lashes cast shadows down her cheeks. “You’re like the sun. You’re so bright and warm and good. You think you can make everyone happier. You make me happy.”
“Please,” Aayushi choked out.
Jaya’s small mouth twisted in a frown. She shook her head but didn’t let go of Aayushi’s hand. “After you left last time, I was so upset. I didn’t know what to do. I only knew what I didn’t want. I didn’t want you to be angry at me anymore. I didn’t want you to be… disappointed in me.”
“I would never,” she said quickly, tangling their fingers together and squeezing.
She received a wry smile in return; Jaya was looking up at her, her dark eyes bright. “I’m sorry. I might have purposely sent an unfinished hem so you would see me.”
A laugh came to her unbidden, had her watching Jaya helplessly, holding onto her hand. “I would have come back eventually.” That was the truth of it: if Jaya thought Aayushi was the sun, then Aayushi couldn’t help but think she was the ground beneath her feet, the steadiness in knowing every day the sun would set and the moon would rise and Jaya’s eyes would glitter like the stars in the sky.
“I love you,” said Jaya softly.
That should have been the end of it. The coin purse should have been ignored. They could stay together - here. Aayushi would wear her blue silk sari and seduce one of the rajput’s sons into marrying her and she could live out her life as a devadasi surrounded by wealth as she practiced her craft. And Jaya? She would stay here, married to Raju, the rich son of the village, who would let Jaya continue to be a seamstress that would impress Aayushi’s future husband. They would be bosom-buddies, gossiping and giggling behind veils, waiting until one of their husbands was out of sight before Aayushi could press her mouth to Jaya and revel in how Jaya gasped and pressed back.
But it wasn’t enough. It never would be. Jaya would languish under the toil of housework and never have her skill recognized apart from being Raju’s limping wife with the clever hands. Aayushi had her duties to her lord-husband Indra-dev as a devadasi; she could not play second-wife to Jaya no matter how much she loved her. This wasn’t the end Aayushi wanted for them, and it was terrifying.
“But,” said Aayushi. “But I can’t keep you.”
The hurt was clear on Jaya’s face: her brows drew together and her jaw clenched. She tried to withdraw her hand but Aayushi held on.
“You deserve more.” She believed it with her entire being, as sure as she was of her dance, her song, when she prostated herself for Indra-dev in the temple courtyard. “So you need to go.”
“You’ll let me go?” Jaya asked.
“Yes,” said Aayushi, nodding to the coin purse still in Jaya’s lap.
It took a moment for her to recognize that Jaya was tearing up, her expression twisted up as she cried. Panic flared in Aayushi’s chest as she launched herself across Jaya’s lap to hug her, press her face into the crook of her neck. Jaya held onto the skirt of Aayushi’s sari, heaving shuddering breaths against Aayushi’s collarbone.
“Nandini,” she started, “Nandini has a cousin in Kodkani, and she wants… She came back from the temple that night and she said she would help me leave, if I wanted.” It took a moment for Jaya to pull back, look up at Aayushi. “If I take your money, I can take my best saris and get to Kodkani, then make my way into Siddapur.”
Aayushi nodded. “I’ll help you. We all will.”
Jaya gave a watery smile. “Thank you.”
It was a sweeter phrase than her confession.
###
The rajput’s sons were delayed by three turns of the moon due to the monsoon season. The brahmins were slick in a sheen of anxiety as they made sure to clean the temple as best they could before the arrival. The rajput’s sons came with an entourage - their soldiers, bodyguards, servants, slaves, and select women from the harem. Ramya was gossiping with the other devadasis when Aayushi finally got on her blue sari, and they crowded together in fascination as the temple gates opened to welcome the royalty.
Aayushi danced - in honour of Indra, in honour of the rajput, in honour of the village of Kargal - along with the other devadasis, keeping beat with Ramya’s high, clear voice as she sang. The sun was low in the sky by the time the welcoming festivities came to a close to the bloody sacrifice of a goat and the serving of food. The devadasis sat aside from the rajput’s sons and brahmins, but the harem women came over to chat.
It was only when one of them got close enough that Aayushi spotted a familiar embroidery of flowers along the hem of one of the women’s sari. Already, her heart was in her throat, her hand reaching out to brush against the silk as the harem women sat around them.
“Who did this?” Aayushi asked without preamble.
Ramya smacked her arm. “She meant your sari is very pretty.”
The other women laughed. The one wearing the sari sat next to Aayushi and looked at the hem. “It’s strange, isn’t it? She put fish instead of flowers, but it’s beautiful.”
“Who?” Aayushi pressed.
The woman tipped her head in recollection. “I got this one while we were in Sagar. There’s a seamstress apprentice there who makes strange designs but they’re popular. I had to get one for myself.”
Ramya leaned forward. “Sagar is south of Siddapur.”
Aayushi scoffed. “I know.” But Ramya was holding her hand now, squeezing her fingers, and Aayushi squeezed back. “That apprentice is going to be famous one day.”
The woman traced her fingers along the embroidered fish before catching the same design over Aayushi’s blouse. Her smile seemed knowing then. “She told me it was made with love.”
Aayushi ducked her head, shy.
Suddenly, the devadasis erupted in whispers as Aayushi looked up to see one of the rajput’s sons walking towards where they were sitting. His eyes were on her. Aayushi let go of Ramya’s hand and straightened her posture. Jaya was working hard to do what she loved; Aayushi wouldn’t fall behind.
The fourth story in our 2018 fiction series. Written by Gurmika Mann and narrated by Maya Chhabra.
“At the Mouth” by Gurmika Mann is set in the southern part of India in the 10th century
Links to the Lesbian Historic Motif Project Online
Links to Heather Online
Links to Gurmika Mann Online
Links to Maya Chhabra Online
I wish I had time to go into more detail about the individual readings collected in this volume, rather than simply summarizing the explanatory material. But if you have any interest in finding out more about the rich history of same-sex relations on the subcontinent--especially before the colonial era--it would be worth tracking down this volume. The editors are working from within their own cultures and have personally created many of the translations included here.
I'm particularly happy to cover this book in the week before the podcast presents a story set in 10th century India involving a devdasi and a seamstress. Many of the themes discussed in Vanita & Kidwai's collection are present in the setting of Gurmika Mann's "At the Mouth", which I hope you will take the opportunity to listen to.
In many parts of the world, the cultural experience of same-sex love struggles against both local prejudice and persecution--often a direct consequence of colonialism, and not a "home-grown" attitude"--and against Western constructions of "the homosexual experience" that assume (or even impose) a specific type of cultural understanding, while excluding other ways of understanding same-sex love from the modern "queer" experience. It's a joy and delight to find scholarly work on non-Western histories that is written by academics working within their own cultures, who have managed to navigate around both types of challenges. Too often, that work is being done by a small number of scholar, and too often they are talked over by the Western queer studies establishment while simultaneously being ostracized by institutions in their own cultures who have yet to untangle the legacy of colonial prejudices.
And for me, in identifying publications to cover, the difficulties include identifying those scholars and their works in the first place, and struggling to have enough understanding to present them in the same critical fashion that I do the more euro-centric material. I'm always happy to take recommendations for publications on cultures and regions of the world that I haven't covered yet.
Vanita, Ruth and Saleem Kidwai, eds. 2000. Same-Sex Love in India: Readings from Literature and History. St. Martin’s, New York. ISBN 0-312-22169-X
[The following is duplicated from the associated blog. I'm trying to standardize the organization of associated content.]
I wish I had time to go into more detail about the individual readings collected in this volume, rather than simply summarizing the explanatory material. But if you have any interest in finding out more about the rich history of same-sex relations on the subcontinent--especially before the colonial era--it would be worth tracking down this volume. The editors are working from within their own cultures and have personally created many of the translations included here.
I'm particularly happy to cover this book in the week before the podcast presents a story set in 10th century India involving a devdasi and a seamstress. Many of the themes discussed in Vanita & Kidwai's collection are present in the setting of Gurmika Mann's "At the Mouth", which I hope you will take the opportunity to listen to.
In many parts of the world, the cultural experience of same-sex love struggles against both local prejudice and persecution--often a direct consequence of colonialism, and not a "home-grown" attitude"--and against Western constructions of "the homosexual experience" that assume (or even impose) a specific type of cultural understanding, while excluding other ways of understanding same-sex love from the modern "queer" experience. It's a joy and delight to find scholarly work on non-Western histories that is written by academics working within their own cultures, who have managed to navigate around both types of challenges. Too often, that work is being done by a small number of scholar, and too often they are talked over by the Western queer studies establishment while simultaneously being ostracized by institutions in their own cultures who have yet to untangle the legacy of colonial prejudices.
And for me, in identifying publications to cover, the difficulties include identifying those scholars and their works in the first place, and struggling to have enough understanding to present them in the same critical fashion that I do the more euro-centric material. I'm always happy to take recommendations for publications on cultures and regions of the world that I haven't covered yet.
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This is an anthology of literature, rather than an analytic text. The organizing principle for selection is examples of love between men or between women who are not biologically related. Literary texts often don’t overtly show the truth of relationships or how those participating in the relationship understood themselves, but they can show how such relationships were represented and expressed.
The passionate attachments represented in these readings may or may not be sexual, but that applies to similar male-female relationships as well. The focus here is on love, not necessarily sex, and the distinction is not treated as important. It also should be noted that same-sex relationships were considered compatible with participation in male-female marriage and with procreation. (Though, at least in the legendary material, procreation doesn’t always require the former.) Only in modern times has an expectation developed that a heterosexual spouse will also be a person’s primary emotional outlet. This collection is also not concerned with depictions of sex that have no emotional or erotic content, for example, the use of sex in power dynamics or same-sex rape.
For the purpose of this collection, “India” is defined geographically, even though the writers of the material often wouldn’t have seen that as their identity.
Same-sex history is often studied in a gender-segregated way, due to the different experiences of men and women. But some approaches identify common factors, hence the decision to include both in this volume. And some of the included texts support the idea of looking at men’s and women’s same-sex experiences together in the context of Indian history, for example, the Kamasutra’s catalog of sexual practices suggests parallels, and texts involving cross-dressing and gender ambiguity are most usefully considered in a common context.
The editors have found no evidence that same-sex love generated significant disapproval or persecution before the 19th century (i.e., before the colonial period) thought it was often treated as inferior to male-female love, or simply ignored.
All the texts in this collection are translated into English (except those originally written in English, of course) and represent most of India’s major languages. The volume has been arranged roughly chronologically. In order to avoid the problem of bias or bowdlerization, the editors have done their own translations of the Hindi and Urdu texts, as well as most of the Persian ones, and have worked closely with the translators for other languages.
There is a discussion of how sexual terminology is handled, both in the discussion and in translating the texts.
The material is presented in three periods: Ancient, covering ca. 1500 BCE through the 8th century CE; Medieval, covering the 8th century up to the British colonial period (roughly the late 18th century); and Modern, covering the period beginning with British rule. There are some absences and asymmetries in the source material, in part due to differences in availability and in part due to access, based on the editors’ own cultural and linguistic backgrounds.
The collection is aimed at general as well as scholarly readers and tries to challenge the myth that same-sex love is a “Western import” to India.
Ancient Texts
This material tends to focus on the ideals of friendship and the intertwining of same-sex friendships with male-female relationships. Many are stories of divine heroes and their extended families. They deal with the relationship between friendship and marriage, or with asceticism and friendship. A prominent motif is miraculous births, including birth from a single parent (female or male) or from a same-sex couple (of either sex), or with the nurturing of a child by a same-sex couple. A related motif may be group marriages or group parenting where same-sex relations are included. Creation myths in the Rig Veda regularly include dual mothers or a group of mothers. Another motif is pairs of mothers who co-nourish each other’s children.
Same-sex relationships may involve or arise from cross-dressing or sex-change situations. A cross-dressed woman may enter into a relationship with another woman, but commonly there is also an element of supernatural sex-change, especially involving the intercession of a forest spirit. A relationship may begin as the marriage of two women and then subsequently involve one of them becoming a man.
In sex-change stories where women become men, the change is generally permanent, while in those where men become women, it is often temporary (for the purpose of procreation) and then later reversed. These gender-change motifs are treated differently in the medieval period.
In Buddhist texts, sex-change may be a symbol of liberation from the expectation to marry. Religious communities were often gender-segregated and the same-sex attachments that developed within them were felt to be less “worldly” than male-female relationships. Gender may be treated as an illusory construct (in some ways, like the modern idea of gender as performance) but within a system that aligns “male” with “enlightened”. This created a space for allowing non-heterosexual relationships.
Sexual categories in legal and medical literature had a different approach. There was a long tradition of recognizing a “third sex”, primarily for men who desired men. Legal texts about sexual crimes tended to focus on sex with an inappropriate subject or with the loss of virginity, and women’s actions were considered less problematic than men’s. Same-sex acts are treated as a minor issue unless rape or loss of virginity was involved. Most same-sex acts were not treated as criminal. Compare, for example, with cross-caste sex acts which were far more stigmatized.
Pseudomedical theories addressing the causes and consequences of same-sex desire are contradictory and unsystematic. This literature provides some terminology for same-sex topics, but nothing that suggests an established concept. They also reflect a general tolerance for same-sex desire. There is more distinction made between sexual activity and celibacy than between same-sex or male-female relations.
Erotic and medical texts provide some explicit references to same-sex acts. Women are described participating in embraces, oral sex, and gender play.
The motif of re-birth is sometimes used to justify unexpected love or desire, whether same-sex or cross-caste. Attachment in a former life was thought to carry over to persons who, in their current incarnations, would be considered inappropriate partners.
(I won’t be listing the specific texts and their contents in detail.)
Medieval Texts
While the ancient texts are represented only by Sanskrit literature, in the medieval period there are several different cultural traditions to consider, in particular, the introduction of Islamic culture, but there is a general diversity of regional and religious cultures. Arabic, Persian, and Urdu traditions join Sanskrit, and the topics include religious stories, epics, historical chronicles, and devotional poetry. Some specific genres include the Bhakti tradition, involving mystical loving devotion to a specific deity (that is, one selected from a number of options, not a type of monotheism).
The medieval literature includes commentaries on older texts. The Puranas introduce a new pantheon who edge out the Vedic gods, among other religious shifts. The everyday observance of sexual taboos coexist with stories of divinities who exist outside those taboos. There is a re-emergence of veneration of mother goddesses which provides a context of bonds between female divinities.
The literature continues themes of sex change and of the children of same-sex couples (of any gender) as well as same-sex marriage.
The depiction of devotional relationships to divinities is more fluid. For example, the female Janabai mystics envisioned god as a loving female companion. Religious monasticism often took the form of marriage resistance, but did not preclude sexual relations and allowed for same-sex relations. Female devdasis entered into a spiritual marriage to a deity (either male or female) and lived outside the marriage structure. This sometimes resulted in matrilineal religious communities.
The emphasis on procreation in marriage could be used to sanction same-sex marriages that produced offspring (either miraculously or via sex-change). Love between women was also depicted in the context of polygynous marriage, and stories told of female lovers marrying the same man in order to stay together, or love developing between co-wives after the marriage.
Within the Persian/Urdu tradition, there is a significant increase in same-sex material in the later medieval period, but it is overwhelmingly male-oriented and associated with Islamic culture. Islamic legal traditions were officially against same-sex relations but cultural traditions contradicted this and elevated love between men. Islamic communities in India did not adhere to conservative Islam, possibly in part due to being always in a minority position. The Sufi tradition focused on love as the core of spirituality. A common poetic motif was for male poets to use a female voice to address a male beloved.
Modern Texts
A great deal of the introduction to this part of the book covers they ways in which British colonial culture altered attitudes toward same-sex love, as well as discussing recent social and political activism.
One curious genre is that of Rekhti poetry, an Urdu form in which a male poet writing in a female voice addresses love poetry to a female beloved. Scholars disagree on the extent to which this reflects the lives of women in same-sex relationships as opposed to the male imagination, but material from the courtesan tradition of “aliyan” (female friends) suggests that women performed Rekhti poetry for each other, and accounts of female same-sex relationships from colonial reports include terminology that matches the vocabulary of Rekhti poetry. So the tentative conclusion is that the genre has some use for understanding women’s lives.
There is a discussion of sexual techniques as reflected in this literature. Then a long discussion of changes in same-sex culture in India under British rule. Modern fiction has introduced a number of tropes that reflect the realities of same-sex relationships, such as the married woman who yearns for her (female) childhood sweetheart. But western influences have also introduced negative depictions of same-sex relations.
Lesbian Historic Motif Podcast - Episode 85 (previously 29d) - Queen Anne - transcript
(Originally aired 2018/12/22 - listen here)
Inspired by the release of the movie The Favourite, I decided to do this month’s essay on its subject: Queen Anne, her circle of female favorites especially Sarah Churchill, Duchess of Marlborough and Abigail Masham, and the rumors of lesbianism that circled around them. Originally, I was going to include a review of the movie as part of this episode, but the essay ran long enough that I’m saving the review for later.
The Historic Outline
Queen Anne of England reigned for a bare dozen years at the very beginning of the 18th century, marking the end of the Stuart dynasty and participating in the complex wrangling over the intersection of politics and religion that had disrupted much of the later 17th century and would continue in the unsuccessful claims of the Catholic branch of the Stuarts well into the mid-18th century. All this has only the barest relevance to the topic of today’s essay, but it may help to set the stage a little and lay out the major players and timelines.
Anne was the younger daughter of King James II of England, who had succeeded his dashing brother, King Charles II. Charles had restored the monarchy to England after the English Civil War, and the label Restoration with all its licentious associations covers the period of Anne’s birth and childhood. Though Charles fathered over a dozen children by his various mistresses, he left no legitimate children to inherit the throne.
Charles had treated religious adherence as something of a political strategy, flirting with Catholicism when it might secure French support, but bowing to Parliament’s pressure to support the Anglican church. But his brother James had converted to Catholicism in mid-life, which didn’t sit well with the English establishment, which was virulently anti-Catholic at a time when religious and political loyalties could not be entirely separated. James’s Catholicism and support for the inclusion of Catholics in government led to his ouster only three years after his coronation, in what was called “The Glorious Revolution.” The idea of deposing monarchs was still a touchy subject after the execution of Charles and James’s father, King Charles I earlier in the century. The Glorious Revolution was led by James’s Dutch son-in-law, William of Orange, resulting in the co-rule of William and Mary. The degree to which William came down on the anti-Catholic side still leaves traces today in how both the name and color Orange is associated with anti-Catholic political groups in Northern Ireland.
To appease the anti-Catholic elements in parliament, King Charles II had required that James’s two surviving children from his first marriage, Mary and Anne, be raised in the Church of England, while allowing the children James had from his second marriage to be raised Catholic. Religion would complicate the succession in various ways.
William and Mary had reigned jointly as equal monarchs -- an unusual approach, given that typically the monarch’s spouse would not have any independent claim to the throne. When Queen Mary died childless, William continued reigning but with the stipulation that if he re-married, his children from that marriage would come after Anne’s children in the succession. This left Anne and her descendents as the next in line. But by 1700, Anne had gone through 17 pregnancies that ended in 7 miscarriages, 7 stillbirths or deaths within a day or so of birth, and 2 early deaths from smallpox. The only child who lived beyond his first couple of years had just died at age 11. The 18th century was not a kind time to be a monarch trying to produce heirs. Anne and Mary were the only survivors of their mother’s 8 pregnancies. Mary did not bring any pregnancies to term.
Faced with the prospect of the next prospective heirs being Catholic, an Act of Parliament stipulated that after Anne the succession would pass to her cousin, Sophia of Hannover, and Sophia’s protestant descendents (thus the sequence of King Georges). A year later, at William’s death, Anne came to the throne. She just barely missed having to deal with the continuing claims by her father James, who had died the year before. Her half-brother James Stuart, known later as “The Old Pretender” was supported by several Catholic monarchs on the continent, but saved most of his active opposition until after Anne’s death in 1714.
So. That’s the political and family background of Anne’s life and reign. So why are we talking about her in a lesbian-themed podcast?
Passionate Friendships and Libertine Sex
You’ll often hear about the phenomenon of Romantic Friendship in the context of the Victorian era--the later 19th century. The term describes a social context where women were expected to have passionate same-sex friendships that were expressed in language and behavior similar to that expected of male-female romantic couples. In fact, female pairs could be even more intense in the expression of their emotional bond than was considered proper between heterosexual couples.
But there have been regular cycles throughout history of a public culture of passionate friendships between women. One of those cycles occurred in the second half of the 17th century. It can be seen expressed in the “Society of Friendship” of Katherine Phillips and the poems she addressed to her closest female friends, or the somewhat more erotic poetry of Aphra Behn. It can be seen in the préciosité movement brought from the Paris salons and associated with Queen Henrietta Maria (the wife of Charles I) that elevated women’s platonic friendships over marriage and heterosexual lust. And it can be seen in female authors toying with the idea of women-only societies, such as in Margaret Cavendish’s The Convent of Pleasure or Delariviere Manley’s The New Atalantis, though not so much in a utopian sense in the latter work as a satirical one. We’ll come back to The New Atalantis in a little bit.
Especially among the aristocracy and literati, the idea of passionate attachments between women was normalized. So when a young Princess Mary (Anne’s sister) wrote the following to courtier Frances Apsley, it was not considered outside acceptable forms of expression:
“I love you with a flame more lasting than the Vestals’ fire. Thou art my life, my soul, my all that heaven can give. Death’s life with you; without you, death to live. What can I say to persuade you that I love you with more zeal than any lover can? I love you with a love that ne’er was known by man. I have for you excess of friendship--more of love then any woman can for woman and more love then even the constantest lover had for his mistress. You are loved more than can be expressed by your ever obedient wife, very affectionate friend, humble servant, to kiss the ground where once you go.”
The young Princess Anne had passionate correspondences with several older female friends (including a rivalry with her sister over Frances Apsley’s affection). There’s some indication that those around her felt that some of these attachments were more intense than was desirable. Mary Cornwallis was a Lady of the Bedchamber (a type of lady in waiting) to Princess Anne but was dismissed from service by Anne’s father due to concerns about the relationship. This doesn’t necessarily mean sexual concerns--there are always reasons to be concerned when someone appears to have an undue influence on a potential heir to the throne--but King Charles was later said to have commented that “No man ever loved his Mistress as his niece Anne did Mrs Cornwallis.” which certainly has suggestions of erotic overtones.
But Anne’s deepest and longest lasting such relationship began when she was perhaps six years old with a girl named Sarah Jennings who would have been eleven at the time. Sarah was a great beauty, ferociously intelligent and witty, and politically savvy, though not without her blind spots. The friendship must have seemed something of an odd couple, though the later stereotype of Anne as dull, frumpy, and overweight does her something of a disservice, and comes in part from the biased memoirs Sarah wrote after their break-up. Anne would become a dedicated and knowledgeable participant in government, and in later years she dealt with crippling chronic pain and illness which contributed to her physical problems. But I get ahead of myself.
18th century society interacted with women’s same-sex relationships on several different layers. There was the mode of intense platonic friendship that might use the language of romance but was treated as being sexless. There was something of a middle ground where people might acknowledge erotic possibilities but deflect their potential in various ways. This can be seen in a poem of 1670 about two women in a “marriage of two beauties” written by a male author in a female voice. The poem’s persona expresses jealousy of male rivals and laments that the “too great resemblance” between her and her friend prevent any romantic success. Other poems written from a male point of view address intimate female couples urging them to consider their love impossible to fulfill so that they will accept the poet’s attentions instead. I’ve included these poems in a previous podcast on homoerotic poetry of the 17th century.
But this was also the era of libertine sexual excess and an era when the concept of binary sexuality--the idea that one had either heterosexual or homosexual desires--had not yet taken solid hold. In the court of Charles II it was no secret that women might engage in sexual affairs with other women. A French visitor to the court reported on love affairs between the maids of honor to the queen and the king’s mistresses. When King Charles discovered that his mistress Hortense Mancini was having an affair with Anne, Countess of Sussex, his disapproval was only because the Countess of Sussex was his illegitimate daughter. (I had fun including this affair in my historic novelette “The Mazarinette and the Musketeer.”)
This isn’t to say that there was no stigma attached to same-sex relationships. Anne’s brother in law, King William also attracted rumors of homosexual relationships with close friends after Queen Mary’s death, in part because of his lack of female mistresses--a striking lack in that era--and in part because it was a popular political weapon against relationships that were felt to exert undue influence or reap undue rewards such as titles. When Anne’s favorites came in for criticism, the primary reason was due to their political influence. Accusations of lesbianism were only a tool to bring to bear on that concern. On the other hand, extra-marital relationships with the opposite sex were similarly looked askance when influence and profit were involved. It’s unclear whether there was any basis to the rumors about William’s relationships, but they contribute to our understanding of the socio-political climate of the times. Note that, unlike sexual relations between women, those between men were a crime under English law.
This climate of romantic and even sexual possibilities between women doesn’t mean that we should interpret the subjects of rumor as being “lesbian” in the modern exclusive sense. Both Anne and Sarah were happy in their marriages, though of course they would have had little choice but to marry even if they hadn’t been. There is plenty of evidence that Sarah and John Churchill were passionately in love and during their long separations due to his military career, their correspondence smoulders so furiously it’s a wonder it didn’t spontaneously combust. Anne was, perhaps, less overt in expressions of affection to her husband, but she regularly supported Prince George against the criticism of her family. And Anne’s 17 pregnancies in their first 17 years of marriage attest to a consistently active sex life.
I’ll discuss further evidence for the public image of women’s same-sex relationships a bit later when I talk about Delariviere Manley’s political fantasy The New Atalantis.
Having looked at the social context of sexuality in the later 17th century, let’s introduce several other major players besides Anne.
Sarah Churchill, Duchess of Marlborough
Anne’s childhood friend Sarah Jennings married an able and ambitious army officer named John Churchill and devoted much of her energy to furthering his career. Shortly after, Anne married her cousin, a Danish prince named George, (she almost married a different cousin George--the Hanoverian prince who would later succeed her as George I) and as a married woman, she was entitled to set up her own household. Sarah Churchill became Anne’s Lady of the Bedchamber, serving not only as friend and confidante but as an able and loyal advisor--though one who made no distinctions between what she wanted and what she thought the princess should want. The position of Lady of the Bedchamber always had political implications due to the direct access it provided to royal women. Anne’s father James disapproved of Sarah’s appointment, fearing that the strong-willed Sarah would dominate his daughter’s opinions and decisions. He wasn’t wrong. Anne was infatuated with her friend Sarah and several times defied pressure to send her away. But Sarah, in turn, provided a rock of loyalty and support in a turbulent social context when Anne had few people she could rely on that utterly.
Princess Anne wanted the illusion of equality between the two of them in private--the ideal concept of platonic philosophy. A year after Anne’s marriage she wrote to Sarah, “Let me beg of you that you not call me your highness at every word, but be free with me as one friend ought to be with another, and you can never give me greater proof of your friendship than in telling me your mind freely in all things, which I do beg you to do.” They had pet names for each other to emphasize this informality. Anne was “Mrs. Morley” and Sarah was “Mrs. Freeman.” For the rest of Anne’s life, both the strength and weakness of their relationship was that Sarah took her at her word and told her her mind freely in all things, speaking without distinction of rank.
Two years after Anne’s marriage, her uncle King Charles II died and her father James came to the throne. Three years later, King James was deposed by his daughter Mary and son-in-law William. Through the turmoil of the transition, Sarah was at Anne’s side, advising her to distance herself from her father and helping her escape the palace by night, to go join the opposition. Sarah was also behind Anne’s maneuverings to achieve a financial independence from William and Mary’s purse strings, and as a result contributed to a falling out between the sisters that rebounded on her. The Churchills were moving up in the world--he had been named Earl of Marlborough--but between Queen Mary’s hostility and the work of political enemies they had a reversal of fortunes. Marlborough was accused of conspiring with the exiled James and dismissed from his post, though the accusation was later found to be based on forged documents. Anne’s loyalty to them was unshaken and she moved out of the palace rather than obey Queen Mary’s command to dismiss Sarah from her service.
Anne wrote to Sarah, “I have a thousand melancholy thoughts, and cannot help fearing they should hinder you from coming to me; though how they can do that without making you a prisoner I cannot imagine. But let them do what they please, nothing shall ever vex me so I can have the satisfaction of seeing dear Mrs Freeman; and I swear I would live on bread and water between four walls, with her, without repining; for as long as you continue kind, nothing can ever be a real mortification to your faithful Mrs Morley, who wishes she may never enjoy a moment’s happiness in this world or the next, if ever she proves false to you.”
In a presentiment of the later dynamics of their relationship, when Sarah suggested they might go along with Queen Mary’s demand that they separate for a time, Anne replied, “If ever you should do so cruel a thing as to leave me, from that moment I shall never enjoy one quiet hour. And should you do it without asking my consent… I will shut myself up and never see the world more but live where I may be forgotten by human kind.”
The royal sisters never reconciled from the conflict over Sarah Churchill and Mary died of smallpox two years later, leaving no living children. Anne was now officially the next in succession.
Abigail Hill Masham
Now we come to Abigail Hill Masham.
At some point during this period--I haven’t been able to pin down exactly when--Sarah Churchill took into her household a poor relation named Abigail Hill along with two of Abigail’s siblings. The impulse may have been one of charity, but the two must have developed a close and strong relationship because Sarah was happy to promote Abigail’s career. I haven’t found a reference to what position Abigail held in the Churchill household, but some time later Sarah got her appointed as one of Princess Anne’s bedchamber women.
To be clear, there was a distinction between Sarah’s position as Lady of the Bedchamber and the post of Woman of the Bedchamber, which was less ceremonial and involved more of the duties of a personal maid. But both were positions typically filled by upper class women and involved regular intimate access to the person they served.
In addition to whatever family loyalty prompted Sarah to place Abigail in this position, she clearly expected Abigail to serve as her surrogate and representative in Anne’s household, especially when Sarah’s other obligations took her away from court for extended periods. This would be a mistake. Sarah’s other major mistake with regard to Abigail was to assume that they were aligned on the same political side. I’ll talk more about that when we move on to the political context.
Unlike for Sarah Churchill, we don’t have much documentary evidence from Abigail herself regarding her life and position. Contemporary descriptions of her personality and motivations align very strongly to political allegiance: those who considered her an ally said she was, “a person of a plain sound understanding, of great truth and sincerity, without the least mixture of falsehood or disguise, of an honest boldness and courage superior to her sex, firm and disinterested in her friendship and full of love, duty and veneration for the queen her mistress.” Those on the opposite political side described her as, “exceedingly mean and vulgar in her manners, of an unequal temper, childishly exceptious, and passionate.”
Since we don’t have Sarah’s letters sent to Anne--only the memoirs she wrote after they became estranged--we don’t have an even-handed image of what she thought about Abigail before they became rivals. And after that estrangement, Sarah’s opinions were sharply personal, viewing Abigail as a traitor and a viper who failed in proper gratitude to Sarah for furthering her career.
Some time after Anne became queen, Abigail married Samuel Masham, but that belongs to the discussion of how Anne and Sarah began falling out, so we’ll come back to it later.
Delariviere Manley
Another woman who is useful for understanding why lesbian rumors stuck to Queen Anne’s court is a writer named Delariviere Manley, who combined entertainment with political satire and walked a perilous line between being a paid political operative and drawing legal censure for the pointedness of her works. Manley was not a member of Queen Anne’s circle--quite the contrary--but she was a sharp observer of the court.
In 1709--near the middle of Anne’s reign--Delariviere Manley published a roman à clef The New Atalantis, which was a satire of British politics set on the fictional island of Atlantis. Manley so clearly depicted the targets of her critique that she was arrested and questioned about it in preparation for a libel case against her. She steadfastly maintained the work was entirely fictional and the case was eventually dropped, but no one was fooled. The primary targets of her satires were the ruling Whig party, and in particular the Marlboroughs. Among the material incorporated into The New Atalantis was a skit entitled The Secret History of Queen Zarah--that’s “Zarah with a Z”, which gives you a sense of how flimsily disguised the characters were.
The New Atalantis focused heavily on sex and relationships as an alleged driver of the workings of government and of the aristocratic social circles that were intertwined with the official structures. Delariviere knew something of interpersonal drama herself. After a peripatetic childhood accompanying her father’s military postings, at his death she and her sister became wards of a cousin, John Manley. Within a few years, Manley had married her, apparently forgetting that he was already married. A few years after the birth of their son, Delariviere left her husband for the household of Barbara Villiers, Duchess of Cleveland, the one-time mistress of King Charles II. Villiers threw her out half a year later, allegedly for flirting with her son. Delariviere spent several years after that writing plays, but only became famous after the publication of The New Atalantis. From there she moved on to a career as a political pamphleteer, though she returned later to drama and sensational novels.
Although the criticisms encoded in The New Atalantis were wide-ranging, the section that concerns us here focuses on a group of women identified as “The New Cabal.” The work makes clear the homoerotic sexual exploits of the group while entirely avoiding any description of specific physical acts, invoking the reader’s imagination to fill in the silences. The targets of this satire are Queen Anne and her court, especially her female favorites. Manley perhaps felt more free to write about the topic than most authors of the day because her own moral position was fairly abandoned, but she was also writing from a position of criticism, rather than depicting desires she shared. The crucial aspect of her writing is that it reflects ideas and images that were in currency during Anne’s reign.
Although the descriptions of the women’s activities in the novel mostly go no further than “kisses and embraces”, the rules of the New Cabal not only exclude men, but exclude women who have voluntary romantic relationships with men (marriage is grudgingly tolerated as a necessary evil, but male lovers are right out).
The women join in loving couples who pledge not only devotion (and secrecy) but a sharing of property and wealth between them. Most of the descriptions of the women (including those meant to represent contemporary figures) don’t mention gender role play or cross-dressing (cross-dressing wasn’t yet a trope strongly associated with lesbian relationships) but there are a few exceptions. One woman is described as mannish in behavior (though not in dress), and another is described as preferring to “mask her diversions in the habit [i.e., clothing] of the other sex”. But this is not as part of a butch-femme relationship, for her female partner also cross-dresses and together they are said to wander through the seedy parts of the city picking up prostitutes for their shared enjoyment. But for the most part, the women described in the satire are feminine-presenting and partner with other feminine-presenting women.
The exclusively female nature of the group is only emphasized by a grudging allowance for one bisexual member who is intended to represent Lucy Wharton who, in real life, had a female lover in opera singer Catherine Tofts. Another real-life couple in The New Atalantis represents Catherine Colyear, Duchess of Portmore and Dorchester who is paired with a character representing playwright Catharine Trotter, whose work Agnes de Castro also has themes of passionate friendship between women.
One thing in common between all the women depicted in this satire is that they were associated with the Whig political party. And now it’s time to talk about English politics around 1700.
Politics and Power in the Reign of Queen Anne
I’m going to really, really oversimplify this discussion, but it’s kind of important to have at least a vague idea of the sides. At the time, England was only starting to develop something identifiable as political parties. The underlying power struggle between absolute and constitutional monarchy was in full swing--keep in mind that the 17th century was when Parliament flexed its muscles and executed a king--so general interest groups and affinities were just starting to aggregate and align as fixed political parties that competed for control of Parliament. Ministers of State were still generally appointed directly by the monarch, though influenced by the practical need to gain cooperation for goals and policies. The concept of a Prime Minister hadn’t really gelled yet. But we can identify two named political parties during Anne’s reign and the direct competition between them set the stage for the more personal conflicts within Anne’s household.
The Whig party--which, by the way, had nothing to do with the male fashion for wearing elaborate artificial hairpieces at this time--played a major role in ousting James II in the Glorious Revolution. They were strongly anti-Catholic (although that changed in later centuries), often aligned with commercial interests and Protestant dissenters, and promoted the concept of constitutional monarchy.
Their rivals, the Tory party, supported the primacy of the Anglican church against a more broadminded acceptance of religious diversity, and were more inclined to support royal power, having their origins in royalist elements during the English Civil War.
Although the key players during Anne’s reign sometimes fell indeterminately in the moderate middle between these parties and sometimes shifted allegiance, I’m going to oversimplify and identify them by party affiliation toward the latter part of her reign. Three powerful men were the core of Queen Anne’s first government: Sidney Godolphin as First Lord of the Treasury and the Duke of Marlborough--did I mention that the Churchills were elevated to a duchy when Anne came to the throne? He was named commander of the armies. Both had begun as moderate Tories but became increasingly associated with the Whigs due to that party’s support for the ongoing wars on the continent. Oh, and due to Sarah Churchill’s overwhelming support for the Whig party. So let’s just consider them functionally Whigs for the purpose.
The third important man in Anne’s initial government was Robert Harley, Speaker of the House of Commons, who started out a moderate Whig but then shifted to Tory allegiance, so we’re going to consider him the primary Tory figure in this struggle. Confusing, I know.
Queen Anne leaned toward the Tories--that whole royalist thing, you know--but was under significant pressure, not only from Sarah Churchill, to appoint more Whigs to her administration. This pressure was all the more painful as she personally disliked some of the prominent Whig leaders.
Harley initially came into power through the influence of Godolphin and Marlborough but as their interests diverged, he engaged the power of political writers like Daniel Defoe, Jonathan Swift, and Delariviere Manley to influence public opinion toward the Tory side via satirical pamphlets. He also engaged the services of a cousin...Abigail Hill, now Abigail Masham after marrying one of Prince George’s grooms.
Sarah Churchill was perhaps the most influential person at court at the beginning of Anne’s reign--far more influential than the official ministers. Marlborough and Godolphin treated her as a political equal and she was trusted to represent Marlborough’s interests at court while he was abroad with the military. Sarah not only had the queen’s ear, but she was a powerful gatekeeper. She could decide who the queen had time and interest to meet with and who she was too busy for.
Sarah Churchill’s power was not only unofficial. Anne had named her Keeper of the Privy Purse--the official in charge of finances for the royal household. If Wikipedia is to be believed, in the entire history of the English monarchy, only one monarch has ever named a woman to this post: Queen Anne. And she named two: Sarah Churchill, and then later as her replacement, Abigail Masham. The anxieties around the queen’s favorites were not simply about social influence but about real financial and political power. And to some extent about men freaking out over women holding that power and excluding them from the innermost circles of decision-making.
So when Sarah threw her considerable influence in on the side of the Whigs, people took notice and worried. And when Harley saw a chance to counter that influence with an agent inside the queen’s inner circle of favorites and confidantes, you can bet he took that chance, especially after he was forced out of office in 1708 by Whig pressure. By then, Abigail Masham was displacing Sarah Churchill in the queen’s affections, though Sarah hadn’t realized that yet. Abigail might have family feelings and personal loyalty for Sarah, but her own political inclinations were solidly on the Tory side. She didn’t need persuading to act as Harley’s agent within the court.
And with that, we move on to how the inter-personal dynamics played out as Abigail displaced Sarah in Queen Anne’s life.
The Break-Up
The relationship between Anne and Sarah had always been lopsided, but not always in the same way. As noted previously, Sarah was beautiful, brilliant, savvy, and charming. She also had, as one historian puts it, “an almost pathological inability to admit the validity of anyone else’s point of view.” She was certain of the rightness of her opinions and positions and considered it her duty to make Anne see the light and agree with her. She had promised Anne that she would always treat her as an equal and be forthright with her.
But Anne didn’t always want brutal honesty; sometimes she wanted support, companionship, and comfort. Sarah had provided that support and companionship in Anne’s youth and that built up a lot of credit. But when Anne came to the throne, Sarah’s advice and persuasion was no longer directed at helping Anne navigate tricky political waters from a vulnerable position, now it was directed at shaping Anne’s government and policy into the Marlboroughs’ desired form. Sarah ordered Anne to appoint her own Whig allies to cabinet posts, lectured her about affairs of state, and generally treated her like a child.
Anne wanted to please her closest friend but she had her own ideas about government and was developing the will and stubbornness to pursue them. And Sarah was increasingly spending her time away from the court, something that became a sore point between them. Anne’s independence caused immediate friction. In the first year of her reign, a courtier noted, “The dutchess of Marlborough has lately had two terrible Battles with the Queen and she came out from her in great heat, and when the Queen was seen afterwards her eyes were red, and it was plain she had been crying very much.”
Such conflicts were all the more painful because of the bond between them. What we know of the internal dynamics of Anne and Sarah’s relationship comes largely from Sarah’s memoirs written at a time of separation and bitterness. But that bitterness itself gives evidence of the depth of Sarah’s attachment, even if not as single-minded as Anne’s was to her. Anne was besotted with Sarah, writing, “If I writ whole volumes I could never express how well I love you.” Sarah later complained that Anne “desired to possess her wholly.”
Anne was jealous of Sarah’s other female friends, and her expectations regarding Sarah’s attention and presence would become part of their fracture. Anne wrote, “I know I have a great many rivals which makes me sometimes fear losing what I so value.” And regarding one specific friend, Lady Anne Sunderland, “You have often told me that I have no reason to be jealous of her and therefore I will not complain any more till I see more reasons for it, but I assure you I have been a little troubled at it.”
The earliest surviving mention of Abigail Hill in the correspondence Sarah received from Anne appears to portray Abigail as one of those other friends that Anne is jealous of. (Keep in mind here that references to Mrs. Freeman are to Sarah, and Anne’s references to Mrs. Morley are to herself.)
“My fever is not quite gone and I am still lame, I cannot go without limping. I hope Mrs Freeman has no thoughts of going to the opera with Mrs Hill, and will have a care of engaging herself too much in her company, for, if you will give way to that, it is a thing that will insensibly grow upon you… for your own sake, as well as poor Mrs Morley’s, have as little to do with that enchantress as ’tis possible and pray pardon me for saying this.”
But Anne herself was already under the spell of the enchantress Abigail Hill, though her enchantments may have been as simple as being attentive and kind and far more circumspect in how she attempted to use political influence with the queen. By around 1706, the queen’s irritation with the Marlboroughs led her to turn to their rival Harley for political advice. And though they weren’t aware of it at the time, Abigail was a conduit for those communications. This personal and political defection may have given Anne something of a guilty conscience.
In a letter to Sarah she wrote, “I cannot forbear telling you why I disowned my being in a spleen this morning and the cause of my being so. My poor heart is so tender that I durst not tell you what was the matter with me, because I knew if I had begun to speak I should not have been fit to be seen by anybody… The reason of my being in the spleen was that I fancied by your looks and things you have sometimes let fall, that you have hard and wrong thoughts of me. I should be very glad to know what they are that I might clear myself, but let it be in writing for I dare not venture to speak to you for the reason I have told you already… don’t let anybody see this strange scrawl.”
Sarah later annotated this letter with, “she was under the witchcraft of Mrs Hill, however she says she does not deserve the hard thoughts I may have of her and… she adds that she will not be uneasy if I would come to her and calls me unkind, but nobody of common sense can believe that I did not do all that was possible to be well with her, it was my interest to do so. And though I had all the gratitude imaginable for the kindness she had expressed to me for so many years, I could have no passion for her that could blind me so much as to make me do anything that was extravagant. But it wasn’t possible for me to go to her as often as I had done in private, for let her write what she will, she never was free with me after she was fond of Mrs Hill, and whoever reads her letters will find a great difference in the style of them when she really loved me, from those where she only pretended to do so.”
What were the “extravagant” things Sarah declined to do? Was it only a matter of not feeling required to dance constant attendance on the queen? Historians have sometimes seen coded references in texts like this, but it’s hard to be certain. What is certain is that Sarah felt hurt and rejected...even if the reason for that hurt was Anne’s refusal to obey and forgive her at every turn.
A year later in 1707 Abigail’s betrayal became overt. While Sarah was absent from court, Abigail Hill married Samuel Masham, a member of Prince George’s household. It was something of a secret wedding--secret at least from Sarah Churchill, though not from the queen who was present as a witness. But Sarah was blindsided and belatedly came to understand how solidly embedded Abigail was in the queen’s confidence.
Sarah recorded her outrage that ''her cousin was become an absolute favorite, that the queen herself was present at her marriage in Dr. Arbuthnot's lodgings, at which time her majesty had called for a round sum out of the privy purse; that Mrs. Masham came often to the queen when the prince was asleep, and was generally two hours every day in private with her; and I likewise then discovered beyond all dispute Mr. Harley's correspondence and interest at court by means of this woman.'' (I’ve seen some writers interpret the bit about Abigail “coming to the queen and being private with her” as referring to sexual encounters, but it looks more ambiguous to me. The simple personal intimacy of private time together would be enough of a challenge to Sarah’s position.)
The Duke of Marlborough, more wisely, cautioned Sarah to let things be, writing, “What you say of [Abigail] is very odd, and if you think she is a good weather cock, it is high time to leave off struggling; for believe me nothing is worth rowing against wind and tide; at least you will think so when you come to my age.” But Sarah had no intention of ceding the field so easily. She raged, “To see a woman whom I had raised out of the dust put on such a superior air and hear her assure me by way of consolation that the queen would always be kind to me! At length I went on to reproach her for her ingratitude and her secret management with the queen to undermine those who had so long and with so much honour served her majesty. To this she replied that she never spoke to her majesty on business.”
Whether or not Abigail was truthful about not advising the queen on the business of government, Sarah saw her hand at work in Anne’s loss of confidence in the Whig leaders and pressured Marlborough and Godolphin to force Harley to resign from his government positions. But she was no more successful in pressuring Anne to dismiss Abigail than anyone had ever been in pressuring Anne to dismiss Sarah herself.
With relations strained, the beginning of the end came in 1708 in the context of a church service celebrating a significant military victory on the continent. As part of her formal office for the queen, it was Sarah’s duty to select the jewels that Anne would wear for the event. In the coach ride to the church, she discovered that the pieces she’d chosen were not being worn and she concluded that Abigail had contradicted her directions. She and the queen had a terrible quarrel, spilling over in public as they arrived at the Cathedral. And Sarah did an unforgivable thing: impatient with Anne’s continued argument, she told the queen to “Be quiet!”
Even Sarah realized she’d gone too far. She tried unsuccessfully to apologize but Anne refused to respond to her letters or allow her into her presence, saying that she had been told to be quiet and therefore she would give no answer. The only reason that Sarah was not immediately stripped of her court offices was to avoid a public break with her husband who was still a vital part of the war efforts.
If that weren’t bad enough, later that year, Prince George died, and even as Sarah used the logistics of the funeral as a context for coming back into contact with Anne, she made the event all about her continuing conflict with Abigail. And we now get a glimpse of Abigail’s viewpoint, in a letter to an ally indicating that she, too, was more concerned about using Anne’s bereavement as a site for their power struggle, rather than being concerned about comforting the queen.
The break played out in correspondence for some time, with Anne alternately begging for a reconciliation and standing fast against Sarah’s demands that she dismiss Abigail. Some of Abigail Masham’s enemies even suggested putting the matter of her influence over the queen before Parliament, though one prominent Whig objected, “it is impossible for any man of sense, honour, or honesty to come in to an address to remove a dresser from the Queen… only to gratify Lady Marlborough’s passions.” Perhaps even Sarah realized that her campaign against Abigail could only bring ridicule and ruin on herself.
By the end of 1710, Sarah had lost her official positions at court. The prestigious post of Keeper of the Privy Purse was given to her rival Abigail while the posts of Mistress of the Robes and Groom of the Stole were transferred to a new favorite, Elizabeth Seymour, Duchess of Somerset. Like Abigail, Seymour’s closeness to the queen made her a target of political attacks. Even as Sarah lost her struggle, Seymore was moving into Abigail’s place as favorite, due to the latter often being away from court on family business, although there’s no evidence that the two of them had the sort of personal rivalry that had marked the transition from Sarah to Abigail.
With the end of the war in Europe, the Duke of Marlborough became somewhat more dispensable and by the end of 1711 he too had lost his government offices, based on a trumped up charge of embezzlement. With the decline of the Marlboroughs and the Whig party, Harley again climbed in power and influence though his resurgence was short-lived. He fell out of favor shortly before Queen Anne’s death in 1714. But this essay isn’t about the men.
Where Did the Accusations Come From?
Emma Donoghue’s book Passions Between Women opens with the contradictory use of the word “passion” in the correspondence between Queen Anne and Sarah Churchill. For years, their letters had concluded with salutations assuring each other that they were “most passionately and tenderly yours” and speaking of “a sincere and tender passion” felt between them. But when Sarah turned her poison pen against Abigail Masham, she warned that people were linking Anne and Abigail’s names together with descriptions of “stuff not fit to be mentioned of passions between women” with additional insinuations that made it clear that sexual relations were the topic.
Did these two uses of “passion” have separate and distinct meanings to the two women? Or did they represent two points on a continuum of meaning for the word? If Queen Anne became associated in the public mind with lesbian relationships with her favorites, the irony is that Sarah Churchill was one of the sources of that association, even though she herself was an obvious candidate for the same suspicions.
How was that association built? And do we have the evidence to determine whether it was true, either in Abigail Masham’s case or in Sarah Churchill’s? Donoghue’s book tackles the general background to the relationship between romantic friendship and sexual relations across the long 18th century. But we’re concerned with a narrower slice of history here.
The dichotomy between an acceptable image of chaste but emotional friendship between women and an unacceptable image of sordid same-sex erotics has often been used to shield the upper class women who participated in the culture of romantic friendship from accusations of lesbianism. The argument is that the openness and pervasiveness of romantic friendships must mean that they could not have been accompanied by sexual desire or sexual activity. This thinking has a strong streak of “nice girls don’t” in which women capable of expressing the elevated sentiments of friendship in literature or in their own lives are thought incapable of engaging in anything so perverted as lesbian sex. These interpretations are not only complicated by the prejudices that modern historians bring to their studies, but also by the different attitudes and language used by women in history for physical expressions of love. When women speak of “chaste kisses” it can mean something rather different for a woman who classifies only penetrative sex with a man as unchaste.
Suspending judgment regarding any sexual component of the relationship between Anne and Sarah, it’s clear the overall shape of that relationship--including its intense expressions and fierce jealousies--is indistinguishable from a romantic and sexual one. And yet Sarah Churchill was a major source of the rumors that Abigail Masham participated in a lesbian relationship with the queen--or at least that their relationship was being interpreted as such.
Sarah wrote to Anne warning her, “I remember you said… of all things in the world you valued most your reputation, which I confess, surprised me very much, that your majesty should so mention the word after having discovered so great a passion for such a woman, for sure there can be no great reputation in a thing so strange and unaccountable… nor can I think that having no inclination for anyone but one’s own sex is enough to maintain such a character as I wish may still be yours.”
That seems quite unambiguous in terms of what is being implied. The word “unacountable” is something of a code-word for sexually suspect relationships between women. But the word often brings in issues of class as well as gender. When Sarah complains of “so great a passion for such a woman” is it specifically the homoerotic aspect of the relationship that she’s targeting? Or might there be an element of considering Abigail too low-class to be worthy of the queen’s affections? Although Sarah and Abigail were cousins, there was a clear distinction of birth between the two branches of the family.
As I noted earlier in this essay, the sexual possibilities between women were solidly in evidence in the Restoration court that Anne was born into. Given this, can Sarah’s accusations be taken as evidence that her own relationship with Anne was not sexual? Or was Sarah simply so deeply invested in using any tool necessary to dislodge Abigail that she was unconcerned with the implication? After all, Sarah derided Abigail as an ungrateful bitch, a viper, and concerned with her own political interests above the queen’s welfare--which all could reasonably be applied to Sarah as well.
In any event, Anne’s response to the previous was “Sure, I may love whom I please.”
But Sarah wasn’t done. An anonymous ally--quite probably her secretary Mr. Mainwaring-- wrote an long scurrilous ballad ranting about Abigail Masham’s offenses: her ingratitude, her political connivance with Harley, her devoted allegiance to the Anglican church, and with only the thinnest of veils over the suggestiveness, the assertion that she performed “sweet service” and “dark deeds at night” to gain her place. The publication of this ballad was no longer a serious campaign to win back Anne’s attention, it was intended to discredit Abigail and to hurt and humiliate the queen in revenge for the slights Sarah believed herself to have received.
The ballad is given “to the tune of Fair Rosamund” and here are a few of the more suggestive of the 35 verses. I’ve expanded the coded references that were given as initials in the original. The ballad tune itself carries meaning, as the Rosamund of the title (and the original ballad) was a mistress of King Henry II and the song tells of how she was poisoned by the queen, Eleanor of Aquitaine. Did Sarah see herself as the avenging spouse, poisoning her partner’s mistress?
A new ballad to the tune of Fair Rosamund [the tune is also known as “Flying Fame”]
I
When as Qu[een] A[nne] of Great Renown
Great Britain’s Scepter sway’d,
Besides the Church she dearly lov’d
A Dirty Chamber Maid.
II
O! Abi[gail] that was her Name,
She starched and stitch’d full well,
But how she pierc’d this Royal Heart,
No Mortal Man can tell.
III
However for sweet Service done
And Causes of great Weight,
Her Royal Mistress made her, Oh!
A Minister of State.
IV
Her Secretary she was not,
Because she could not write;
But had the conduct and the Care
Of some dark deeds at Night.
V
The Important Pass of the Back-Stairs
Was put into her Hand;
And up she brought the greatest R[ogue]
Grew in this fruitful land.
VI
And what am I to do, quoth he,
Oh! for this Favour great!
You are to teach me how, quoth she,
To be a sl[ut] of State.
And so on at great length, concluding with a hopeful, if irrational, prediction that the subject of the song would be rejected and cast out.
Another likely output of Sarah and Mainwaring’s collaboration was a pamphlet entitled The Rival Duchesses with an imagined conversation between Abigail Masham and Madame de Maintenon, the official mistress of King Louis XIV of France. In it, Abigail boasts, “Especially at court I was taken for a more modish lady, was rather addicted to another sort of passion, of having too great a regard for my own sex, in as much that few people thought I would ever have married. But to free myself from that aspersion some of our sex labor under, for being too fond of one another, I was resolved to marry as soon as I could fix to my advantage or inclination.”
At which Madame de Maintenon asks, “And does that female vice, which is the most detestable in nature, reign among you, as it does with us in France?”
To which Abigail responds, “O Madam, we are arrived to as great perfection in sinning that way as you can pretend to!”
Having almost certainly participated in the creation and circulation of these two items, Sarah Churchill then called them to the queen’s attention, writing with studied casualness, “I had almost forgot to tell you of a new book that is come out: ... the subject is ridiculous, and the book not well written, but that looks so much the worse, for it shews that the notion is extensively spread among all sorts of people. It is a dialogue between Madame Maintenon and Madam Masham...and there is stuff, not fit to be mentioned, of passions between women...”
Sarah even brought Anne’s physician into the matter, confiding to him, “I hear there is some [pamphlet] lately come out, which they said were not fit for me to see, by which I guess they are upon that subject that you may remember I complained to you, and really it troubled me very much upon my own account as well as others, because it was very disagreeable and what I know to be a lie, but something of that disagreeable turn there was in an odious ballad to the tune of fair Rosamund, printed a good while ago… but that which I hated was the disrespect to the Queen and the disagreeable expressions of the dark deeds in the night.”
Sarah was not the only one implying lesbian goings on among the court. As noted before, in the midst of the conflict between Sarah and Abigail, Delariviere Manley’s satire The New Atalantis was published, implying romantic and erotic relationships among an all-female cabal who were clearly identifiable with prominent women of the Whig party. (I plan to do an entire episode on The New Atalantis at some point, so I won’t hunt down excerpts for this episode.)
Were lesbian relationships actually common in those circles? Or was it simply a smear tactic? Was the satire inspired by Anne’s close relationships with her female favorites? Or was it simply one more example of anxieties about power and class being translated into anxieties about sex?
When King William III was rumored to have a homosexual relationship with a close male friend, one can trace some of the motivation for the rumors in jealousy over the man’s rapid rise to high rank. The power and influence that both Sarah Churchill and Abigail Masham had with the queen certainly provoked jealousy and anxiety, not only in each other, but among the male establishment, who felt shut out of the largely female structure of Anne’s household. Sexual accusations have always been handy weapons to use against women who are felt to have risen above their rightful station.
This isn’t to say that the free-floating motivations for people to make sexual accusations against Anne and her favorites makes those accusations untrue. Only that it provides a context in which the rumors stuck, to the point where the Dowager Duchess of Orleans in France, writing after Anne’s death, reported, “English men and women depict Queen Anne horribly here, saying she would get drunk, after which she’d make love with women, being, however, fickle and changing often. Lady Sandwich did not tell me anything, but she told my son. I had little contact with her, because she disgusted me, admitting that she had allowed herself to be used for such perversions.”
Queen Anne gets something of a bad rap in all this. She seems through it all to have been doing her best to balance personal desires with what she believed to be the good of the State, all while suffering in terrible pain from chronic illnesses. If she shifted her affections regularly from the women who left her to the women who were there to comfort and support her, who can blame her?
When one digs through the coded language, the self-deception, the imagery, and the strength of the emotional reactions, it seems quite plausible to me that Anne’s relationships with women had an erotic component. And that the gymnastics gone through to exclude that possibility in historic analysis most often reflect the biases of the analyst.
Even if one takes an extremely conservative position that the sexual allegations were all politically motivated, it’s undeniable that Anne’s deepest and most lasting emotional relationships were with women like Sarah Churchill and Abigail Masham and that those relationships existed in a cultural context where other women with such bonds definitely were engaging in sexual relationships.
So, lesbian or not? The distinction seems scarcely worth making.
The social and historic context of Queen Anne of England and the basis for the rumors of lesbianism associated with her court.
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I've rearranged the order the next several publications come in, because this one seemed like a good one to kick off the sequence of material on Asia. I feel very self-conscious about how thoroughly Euro-centric the majority of the Project is, but at the same time, I have many of the same limitations discussed in this article. In particular, I'm largely limited to material published in English. But I've added half a dozen new items to my to-do list and maybe they'll point me towards some other useful sources.
Garber, Linda. 2005. “Where in the World are the Lesbians?” in Journal of the History of Sexuality 14.1-2: 28-50.
Garber details the thought process that went into developing an LGBTQ course for her university’s “global” core requirement, resulting in a course on Asian Gay and Lesbian Cultures. Garber’s academic focus was 20th century US lesbian writers so she worked in collaboration with a colleague with a focus on Asian history and literature.
Developing the curriculum ran into two major challenges: needing to use source material available in English (based on the target student body) and what Garber introduces as “the Woman Problem in Queer Studies”, that is the historic overwhelming focus on men and male issues in both academic and politically-oriented groups addressing issues of sexuality. This has regularly become a viscious circle where male domination of supposedly inclusive groups and fields has resulted in those interested in female topics branching off and forming separate, woman-focused groups, which only intensifies the tendency for the “general” field to be left to men’s issues (which then intensifies the impression that men's experiences are the "default" while women are a special case). These twin issues of participation and representation have shaped the nature of both academic queer studies and political activism. The study of the history of homosexuality too often becomes the study of the history of male homosexuality, with women relegated to footnotes or ignored with a shrug as being a complication. (In the introduction to one author’s book on same-sex sexuality in Japan, he notes that “female-female sexuality in Japan demands a more thoroughgoing treatment than I am able to give it here.” after devoting an entire tome to male-male sexuality.)
This tendency has been recapitulated as queer studies and politics expand into a more global focus, even as many non-western cultures resist the hegemony of specifically western images and understandings of variant sexuality. What Garber found while developing her syllabus was that nearly all book-length studies about queer topics in Asia were written by and about men, and even anthologies favored men over women significantly. The connection between male authors and male topics is not solely one of personal interest: there are often social barriers to men doing sociological research among female homosexual communities.
The authors frequently excuse their exclusive focus by noting that the cultures they study did not view male and female homosexuality as having common factors (and therefore that it doesn't make sense to treat them together), or simply that material on women is scarce (which it is, when you're looking in male-oriented spaces). This last argument, made by Bret Hinsch in Passions of the Cut Sleeve: The Male Homosexual Tradition in China is contradicted by the sources discussed by Sang Tze-lan in The Emerging Lesbian: Female Same-Sex Desire in Modern China.
Another hazard of the field is studying the ways in which non-western approaches to sexuality differ from western ones, as well as how the introduction of western medical and psychological theories changed those regional understandings. Thus, for example, the problem of interpreting Japanese discussions of women’s same-sex or cross-gender behavior without forcing it into English terminology. Another face of this problem is in using Foucault’s approach to the definition of homosexuality, which, when applied in a strict sense, excludes any consideration of sexuality prior to 1870 or outside the West. That is, if one defines the topic of one’s study as “homosexuality” and defines “homosexuality” as a concept of fixed personal orientation specific to post-1870 western culture, then it isn’t possible to research, for example, “homosexuality in pre-modern China.”
There are historic traditions of acceptance of same-sex love in China, Japan, and India, but in all cases these traditions were disrupted by the introduction of western pathologizing of homosexuality, enforced via colonialsm. Or, alternately, by a transfer of association of same-sex love to western influence, which erased the pre-existing tradition of tolerance. The “Foucauldian Orthodoxy” is being challenged by scholars of sexuality working within their own cultures and rediscovering those pre-existing historic traditions, such as work by Ruth Vanita and Gita Thadani on India.
Vanita points out that works such as the Kamasutra treat male and female sexuality in parallel, and work to develop a categorization of identities based on sexual behavior and desires. Other literary traditions from the subcontinent include medieval Perso-Urdu poems in the ghazal (love poem) genre (though usually involving love between men), or the use in Urdu poetry of the term chapti (clining or sticking together) for sex between woman and for women who engage in it.
Considerations of terminology and the categories they imply are central to any study of this type. Garber notes Judith Halberstram’s discussion in Female Masculinity about how to develop a framework for studying pre-modern cross-gender behavior in a way that doesn’t evaluate individuals against a modern template of the “lesbian”. Issues of anachronistic application of terminology are always present in historical studies, of course, even when working with more everyday concepts like “family, marriage, slave, master, law, woman, or man.”
This approach to historic subjectivity can come in conflict with modern social movements that see the claiming of international identity terms like “lesbian” as a refusal to accept a social tolerance that requires silence and anonymity. But at the same time, the development of a culturally-specific vocabulary for queer sexuality can founder on the rocks of a multitude of nuanced terms with no clear agreement on umbrella terms. (Examples are given from Japan and China.) The study of this vocabulary and its cultural context--even when it fails to align with western concepts of homosexuality--provides a path for the inclusion of women’s lives and voices in studies of sexuality.
Garber closes with a literature review of resources she considered for her syllabus. I’ve included the ones that look relevant and interesting to my readership below (as well as adding them to the “shopping list” for the Project). There is also a catalog of modern (20th century) writers who represented their own love for women in their work, such as Japanese poet Yosano Akiko, feminist Miyamoto Yuriko and her partner jounalist Yuasa Yoshiko. Authors from India include Kamala Das (writing in English and Malayalam), Urdu novelist Ismat Chughtai. Diasporic writers mentioned include Anchee Min’s memoir of the Chinese Cultural Revolution, Gail Tsukiyama’s historic novels, and Margaret Topley’s historical essays.
Garber also discusses representations of same-sex love in modern television and cinema in Asia.
Readings mentioned that are of particular interest
Tze-Lan, Sang. 2003. The Emerging Lesbian: Female Same-Sex Desire in Modern China. Chicago. pp.44-45
Robertson, Jennifer. 1998. Takarazuka: Sexual Politics and Popular Culture in Modern Japan. Berkeley. p.68
Vanita, Ruth and Saleem Kidwai, eds. 2000. Same-Sex Love in India: Readings from Literature and History. St. Martin’s, New York.
Vanita, Ruth (ed). 2002. Queering India: Same-Sex Love and Eroticism in Indian Culture and Society. New York.
Thadani, Giti. 1996. Sakhiyani: Lesbian Desire in Ancient and Modern India. Cassell, London. ISBN 0-304-33452-9
Ng, Vivien. 1997. “Looking for Lesbians in Chinese History” in Duberman, Martin (ed) A Queer World. New York.
Robertson, Jennifer. 1999. “Dying to Tell: Sexuality and Suicide in Imperial Japan” in Signs 25, no. 1: 1-35.
Robertson, Jennifer (ed). 2004. Same-Sex Cultures and Sexualities. Malden MA.
(Originally aired 2018/12/15 - listen here)
Heather Rose Jones: Last week, we had Carrie Pack on the show to talk about her own writing. In this episode, she's here to talk about queer women in historically based books by other authors that she's particularly enjoyed. Welcome back, Carrie.
Carrie Pack: Hi, good to be back.
H: So, let's punch right in. What's your first book?
C: Actually, my first one is kind of incidentally historical because it feels historical. I’m not sure it was intended to be, but I’m a big fan of Malinda Lo. Her stuff is largely contemporary, but if you look at some of her fantasy stuff, Ash is one of my all-time faves, and it feels historical because it's the Cinderella retelling. If anyone listening hasn't read that yet, it's just a really great, different take on Cinderella where Cinderella kinda falls for, basically, the huntress that's been hired to – oh, that’s Snow White – never mind, [Laughter] but, yeah, Ash falls for another woman in that book. It was one of the very first lesbian stories that I read. And for that reason, it just holds a really special place in my heart.
H: Yeah, she takes a very common fantasy approach of setting it in a vaguely mishmash historical, medieval sort of thing.
C: Yes.
H: Yeah, absolutely. I read that when it first came out. It’s fabulous.
C: There's another one I’m really looking forward to that doesn't come out until November 13th, but it is Robin Talley who is a very well-known lesbian YA author and she previously, I think her previous historical was Lies We Tell Ourselves, takes place in the 1950s. She's got a new one coming out in November called Pulp, and I’m really interested in it because like with Grrrls on the Side, it's very much rooted in some literary history of queer culture, but it's kind of a half and half. So, it’s half contemporary, half historical where one of her point of view characters is in the past. I’m really looking forward to it, but, obviously, I haven't read it yet because it doesn't come out until November.
H: So, is it more of a parallel story or is it an actual time slip with consciousness going back and forth or…?
C: The way that I read it is that it’s kind of they're both dealing with – it kind of reminded me of, gosh, what's the one where like they’re reading letters from…?
H: Lake House or something like that?
C: Yeah, but I don't think it's got that supernatural kind of element, might be a little more kind of like Julie & Julia where she's like inspired by reading this writing of —
H: Ah, so, parallel? Parallel lives, it’s sort of.
C: Yeah, I think it is.
H: Yeah, that works really nicely as a way of doing the compare and contrast thing.
C: Yeah, it's about a character in the 1950s who’s gay or who’s queer – it doesn't really kind of say for sure – but she discovers a series of books about women falling in love with other women. And then, the contemporary part of the story is that she’s, the character, is doing a senior project on 1950s lesbian pulp fiction. So, the two are intertwined in that way, but they’re parallel in that sense. I just thought that was really fascinating, too, because it’s kind of like what I said I did with Grrrls on the Side which is kind of looking at some history through the lens of a contemporary approach. So, that's why I’m really excited about it.
H: Cool.
C: Plus, I love all those old lesbian cult novels. They just had such – they were so lurid and tantalizing but also just what a great cultural point to really talk about. So, I think it can be a really fun, interesting novel.
H: Uh-huh. Anything else?
C: That's kind of it. I still have immense guilt that I had a friend recommend to me Tipping the Velvet many, many times. I have it on my kindle, and I have not read it. And I’m like, I want to read it so desperately, but it's one of those, like, I want it to be as good as it is in my mind. And I just – [Laughter] I know. It’s the same reason I never read Gone with the Wind when I was a big fan of the movie. It’s like I didn't want something to ruin the idea I had in my head.
H: Yeah, and I think it's one of those books where if you're gonna read the book, read it before you see the movie because you can't unsee, and movies always change things. But, yeah, it's a very different flavor of book than, say, the run-of-the-mill les fic. It's very dark and bleak in some ways even though it has a happy ending. It's interesting.
C: I mean, I think that's the part for me writing anything historical that I wanna get away from is the bleakness. I feel like we've had so much bleakness. There's a place for that. There’s a place for telling those authentic struggles, but I want some happy stuff, and I wanna write some happy stuff. So, I think that's where my writing will probably go next and where my reading is really focused, too. So, hopefully there's more of that stuff coming out.
H: Yeah, and I think one of the things that's unfair is people say, “Oh, well, life was horrible in history for queer people,” but life was horrible in history for 99.9% of people. So, if we're gonna allow ourselves to write happy endings for straight characters all throughout history, then we should have the same right to completely ignore the historical awfulness and write happy stories for queer people in history.
C: Yeah. I mean look at all the historical romances and some of them cover, like, a 20-year time period. It's like if all those women who couldn't own land or vote or had to submit to their husbands, all that stuff, if they can have happy endings, so can all the lesbian and bisexual women out there. They can.
H: Uh-huh, absolutely.
C: You know? Come on. Come on.
H: So, I'll put links to the books you mentioned in the show notes and thank you so much for coming on the show to share your favorite books with us.
C: Thank you.
In the Book Appreciation segments, our featured authors (or your host) will talk about one or more favorite books with queer female characters in a historic setting.
In this episode Carrie Pack recommends some favorite queer historical novels:
Links to the Lesbian Historic Motif Project Online
Links to Heather Online
Links to Carrie Pack Online
This is the article that Donoghue references with respect to possible evidence of 18th century women in Amsterdam having meeting places for engaging in same-sex activities. The evidence is fairly tenuous but at least indicates that there may have been clusters of women who came together around this shared interest. But in considering the women discussed in this article one needs to keep in mind the nature of the record. When you’re looking at evidence for sexual behavior from trial records, one is necessarily going to be considering the lives of people who have done something they’ve been put on trial for. And in the way of the world, the question of who gets put on trial for transgressive sexual behavior is not neutral with respect to things like class and occupation. All of these women were poor, had marginal roles in society, and had a history of socially disruptive behavior.
Van der Meer comes to a tentative conclusion that there was a tradition of sex between women that was strongly associated with socially disruptive behaviors (e.g., drunkenness) and with prostitution. But I think he fails to consider the extent to which most women whose lives were detailed in court records had similar backgrounds, even when the offenses didn’t involve same-sex activities. These records certainly indicate that there was a general awareness of the possibilities (and techniques) of sex between women, and that people of that time don’t seem to have considered homosexual acts to require a specific and restricted interest in women as partners. But I don’t think that this set of data necessarily gives us an accurate picture of all sexual possibilities between women in that time and place, any more than the theories of late 19th century physicians about their homosexual patients did. A "respectable" middle-class woman who did not engage in public drunkenness or brawling wasn't going to end up in a court record discussing her sex life regardless of what went on in her bed. So a thoery of the development of lesbian identity in the Netherlands that looks narrowly at the evidence of trial records is going to come up with flawed conclusions.
But the larger historical picture is made up of small, specific individual topics like this. Then to see the whole, we need to put them together and take a few steps back.
Van der Meer, Theo. 1991. “Tribades on Trial: Female Same-Sex Offenders in Late Eighteenth-Century Amsterdam” in Journal of the History of Sexuality 1:3 424-445.
[The following is duplicated from the associated blog. I'm trying to standardize the organization of associated content.]
This is the article that Donoghue references with respect to possible evidence of 18th century women in Amsterdam having meeting places for engaging in same-sex activities. The evidence is fairly tenuous but at least indicates that there may have been clusters of women who came together around this shared interest. But in considering the women discussed in this article one needs to keep in mind the nature of the record. When you’re looking at evidence for sexual behavior from trial records, one is necessarily going to be considering the lives of people who have done something they’ve been put on trial for. And in the way of the world, the question of who gets put on trial for transgressive sexual behavior is not neutral with respect to things like class and occupation. All of these women were poor, had marginal roles in society, and had a history of socially disruptive behavior.
Van der Meer comes to a tentative conclusion that there was a tradition of sex between women that was strongly associated with socially disruptive behaviors (e.g., drunkenness) and with prostitution. But I think he fails to consider the extent to which most women whose lives were detailed in court records had similar backgrounds, even when the offenses didn’t involve same-sex activities. These records certainly indicate that there was a general awareness of the possibilities (and techniques) of sex between women, and that people of that time don’t seem to have considered homosexual acts to require a specific and restricted interest in women as partners. But I don’t think that this set of data necessarily gives us an accurate picture of all sexual possibilities between women in that time and place, any more than the theories of late 19th century physicians about their homosexual patients did. A "respectable" middle-class woman who did not engage in public drunkenness or brawling wasn't going to end up in a court record discussing her sex life regardless of what went on in her bed. So a thoery of the development of lesbian identity in the Netherlands that looks narrowly at the evidence of trial records is going to come up with flawed conclusions.
But the larger historical picture is made up of small, specific individual topics like this. Then to see the whole, we need to put them together and take a few steps back.
# # #
Van der Meer presents the details and circumstances of trial records from several late 18th century cases in Amsterdam, Netherlands of women arrested for events involving sexual activity with women. Sodomy trials of men were not uncommon in this context, often occurring in “waves” when some particularly eager administration pursued the cases. But the conviction and exile in 1792 of Bets Wiebes for lying upon another woman “in the way a man is used to do when he has carnal conversation with his wife” appears to be the first case of that type known from records.
The trial of Bets Wiebes falls just before one of the periods of prosecutions for sodomy, and given that there were also three other trials for “tribadism” in the following years, they seem to have been part of a general uptick in pursuing moral offenses. One of the judges involved in the cases kept a private journal in which he describes the accused of engaging in “caresses and filthy things”, “sodomitical filthiness” or “evil malignities”.
In all, Van der Meer identified cases involving 12 women, out of a total of about 600 total people prosecuted for same-sex offenses in the Netherlands in the 18th century. Such prosecutions ended in 1811 with the introduction of the French penal code in Holland, which did not criminalize same-sex acts.
Prior to the 1792 prosecution of Wiebes, there were certainly references to women having sex with women, as in the following observation from 1750 by the former landlady of two Amsterdam women (age 50 and 60). They were “living as if they were man and wife...feeling and touching one another under their skirts and at their bosoms....yes, she had even seen how in broad daylight while committing several brutalities Mooije Marijtje lay down on Dirkje Vis, having both of them lifted their skirts and their front bodies being completely naked, Marijtje made movements as if she were a male person having to do with a female.”
Van der Meer also refers the reader to the cases involving both cross-dressing and same-sex acts in Dekker and van de Pol 1989. In particular, the famous case of Hendrikje Verschuur “the heroine of Breda” who joined the army as a man and took part in the siege of Breda in 1637. Hendrikje had sexual relations with several women, including Trijntje Barends about whom it was said “they had been so besotted with one another that they would have liked to marry if it had been possible.”
But the 18th c. cases described in the present article did not involve cross-dressing and the women involved were prosecuted specifically for sexual activity, though in some cases it came to light in the context of a different charge. As in the trial records of male sodomites, the sexual acts are recorded in explicit detail (providing a type of data that is otherwise rare for women). In general, reports of women’s same-sex activities come from popular literature or pornography and focus on the motif of unusually large clitorises or the use of dildoes.
The following are summaries of the trial evidence and background. In circumstances, the cases were all fairly different from each other apart from the sexual accusations. Although physical acts were discussed, the emotional relationships between the women were generally not noted unless used as leverage to persuade testimony.
Bets Wiebes & Martha Schuurman
Bets Wiebes was involved in a romantic and sexual triangle with two other women: Catharina de Haan and Bartha Schuurman. Wiebes and Schuurman lived together and had a sexual relationship, but Wiebes had begun a separate covert relationship with de Haan. Schuurman, in a jealous rage, murdered de Haan. Initially Schuurman accused Wiebes of the murder (and so was released) at which Wiebes went into hiding dressed as a man and with cropped hair in order to avoid testifying against Schuurman. When finally arrested, Wiebes claimed she was too drunk to remember what happened on the night in question, but Schuurman was arrested again for further interrogation and three months later Wiebes changed her testimony to accuse Schuurman, after which Schuurman confessed. (There were various threats of torture involved in these interrogations and confessions but torture was never actually used.) When asked about her shifting testimony, Wiebes indicated she was trying to protect Schuurman who had a child to care for.
Schuurman testified that she had been jealous of de Haan because of the “dirty lusts” that Wiebes had engaged in with both of them. She described how “during the time they had lived together, Bets Wiebes many a time had lain upon her in the way a man is used to do withen he had carnal conversation with this wife and that they had known one another in this way.” Wiebes denied the sexual relationship, even when neighbors testified that “she used to caress Schuurman’s breasts and put her head in her lap.”
Schuurman was executed (for the murder) and Wiebes was exiled from the city for 6 years (for the sexual offense).
There is more information about the backstory of these women. Wiebes seems to have had long-term behavioral problems. Her mother had her committed to a workhouse for habitual drunkenness and theft. On her release, her mother had re-married, so Wiebes needed a new place to live. Schuurman offered her lodgings, and when Schuurman’s husband died at sea, the two relocated to a cheaper place together and set up in business selling news broadsides.
Wiebes had met de Haan in the workhouse and paid her regular visits after they both got out, which made Schuurman jealous. Schuurman burst into de Haan’s house to find the two of them drinking together and began quarreling. The upset continued for several days, with Schuurman shouting that she’d “make short work of this.” Schuurman again showed up at de Haan’s house when Weibes was there, but in a more friendly mood, which made the other two suspicious. But Weibes left them together. Later, Weibes returned to the home she shared with Schuurman only to find both Schuurman and de Haan there. At the moment of her entrance, Schuurman stabbed de Haan to death.
A possible complication? The coroner later described de Haan as being naked from the waist up. And why was de Haan at Schuurman’s place at all? Might the final side of the “triangle” have been completed?
The extent to which Weibes was willing to protect Schuurman, even to her own peril, suggests a strong emotional attachment.
Gesina Dekker, Willemijntje van der Steen, Pietertje Groenhof, Engeltje Blauwpaard
These four women, who apparently shared a house, were arrested in 1796 but the circumstances of their accusation were unclear. The house was rumored to be “a place where disreputable people gathered” possibly a brothel. The house was said to be one where women came to caress and kiss one another and feel under each other’s skirts. Gesina Dekker admitted that she lay on the floor with Engeltje Blauwpaard who performed digital stimulation in her vagina. Groenhof admitted to taking part in the caressing “after having been seduced with coffee and alcohol”. Blauwpaard, though she denied the accusations, was said to be very jealous over Dekker.
Other authors have interpreted these events as possibly indicating that the house was a known meeting place for women to have sex with each other.
Anna Grabou
Arrested in 1797 after her neighbors complained about verbal aggression. Grabou seems to have been generally bad-tempered, but also prone to making indecent proposals to her female neighbors. To one she suggested that they should hook up for sex when Grabou’s husband was away from home, with additional comments that she wanted to see her naked. To another she made comments about what she looked like “below your skirt.” To a third, she said, “you have something in your being that attracts both male and female” and expressed her love. To a fourth, Grabou boasted that she had sex every morning with her maid and that the maid preferred her to a man.
Christina Knip
Arrested in 1797 for raping a 14-year-old girl with a dildo. She invited the girl into her home, threw her on the bed, and forcibly penetrated her with a dildo tied around her body.
Anna Schreuder, Anna de Reus, Catrina Mantels, Anna Schierboom, Maria Smit
Arrested in 1798 for their own protection from a mob. Neighbors had suspected Schreuder and Smit of unspecified activities for some time and spied on them through a hole from a neighboring room while they were engaging in sex. The neighbors later testified that the two had lain together with their lower bodies naked, had kissed and caressed each other “like a man is used to do to a woman”, had moved up and down on each other, and finally that one had lifted her leg over the other’s shoulder who had then performed oral sex on her.
Evidently the peeping went on for several hours, with other neighbors being invited to watch, until finally one of the watchers yelled accusations at them. Schreuder and Smit left the room but the neighbors assembled a mob outside the house until the constables came and took all five women to the police station. Schreuer at first confessed to the neighbors’ accusations but later recanted claiming the police had threatened her with mutilation. The neighbors also accused the women of singing banned political songs but this does not appear to have been converted into a legal charge.
A regular theme across the trials appears to have been requests from the prosecution to be allowed to torture the women for confessions, which permission was never granted. Few of the women confessed to anything and most were released with a warning.
Susanna Marrevelt
This case never went to trial, but in a deposition, her husband’s uncle said he’d found Marrevelt and her maid embracing each other with “unnatural movements”, and one of the uncle’s servants said she’d seen Marrevelt and her maid touching each other’s genitals. Marrevelt's maid was also accused of fondling the other servant against her will, and took exception to this and pushed the other woman down the stairs, injuring her.
General observations
Many of the women in these accusations were married (as were many of the men prosecuted as sodomites) and in some cases had children. Most of them were impoverished, with marginal jobs, if any. Several had spent time in a workhouse for drunkenness or anti-social behavior. Some had worked as prostitutes, and in some cases their eventual sentence was for heterosexual sex work rather than homosexual acts. Unlike the men prosecuted for sodomy, the women don’t seem to have had a pattern of participating in a homosexual network, or having other behavioral characteristics suggesting a sexuality-related identity. The exception being van der Steen’s house, which may have been a regular meeting place for lesbian encounters.
Looking at the timeline of prosecutions of sodomites (including women), when the first wave occurred in 1730 there was a lack of public interest in the issue. People didn’t perceive sodomy as criminal and weren’t eager to turn their neighbors in to the authorities for it, even when they’d been aware of their habits for years. Generally the law was invoked when there was also verbal or physical aggression. But in some cases extra-legal punishments were committed by those same neighbors.
The women involved in these cases were often considered a bit crazy by their neighbors, though examples given of this may seem sane to us, as when Knip’s neighbor asked why she hadn’t married and her response was, “Just to fuck? I can do that myself.” The mob peeping at Schreuder and her partner may not have intended to involve the authorities at all, but that became unavoidable when a riot broke out. When Susanna Marrevelt’s husband was complained to by his uncle, he replied it was none of the uncle's business.
But that doesn’t mean that the women’s sexual activities were treated as of no consequence by their families. While Gersina Dekker was in prison, her husband began separation proceedings. Anna Grabou’s husband used the trial evidence to initiate a divorce. Overall, though, sex between women was treated less severely than sex between men with sentences being about half the length and often reduced further.
But as the century progressed, both law and religion began to develop a framing of sodomy as being part of an expected progression of moral failing. Once one had fallen into drunkenness, gambling, swearing, etc., sodomy was sure to follow. It represented “the world turned upside down” and in the last quarter of the century, stereotypical ideas of “manliness” became equated with the health of the state. This made sodomites a social hazard. Sex between women was not viewed as presenting this same social hazard.
There is a review of vocabulary associated with sex between women (including the mistaken claim that the word “lesbian” didn’t exist in the 18th century). In addition to the usual Latin terms (tribades, fricatrices, subigatrices) that were generally restricted to legal or theological contexts, the court records discussed here used vernacular terms translated as “tribadism”, “evil malignities”, “sodomitical filthiness” and two Dutch terms are mentioned: sodomieterije (sodomy) only once used in reference to a woman, and terms derived from the verb lollen (to foul) which the article notes as “no longer existing” evidently meaning in the modern language.
The verb stem lol- appears in a number of sex-related compounds with a sense of disapproval: lolhoeren (foul whores), lolder (sodomite, but apparently only for men?), lolhuis (literally “foul house”, brothel). Possibly by the 19th century, certainly in the 20th, the compound lollepot was used for lesbians and in contemporary word pot is used similarly to “dyke”. (Van der Meer suggests that like the origin of “bugger” in a reference to a specific religious heresy, lollen may have its roots from the medieval Lollard heretical sect.) While references to male sodomites tended to treat them as an identifiable behavior-based category, tribadism was viewed as part of a general pattern of female misbehavior associated with drunkenness and prostitution.
Although Dutch laws of the 18th century did not specifically include women under the topic of sodomy, commentary on the law indicated that individuals prosecutors considered that sex between women was covered. But although the prescribed penalty for sodomy was death, this was rarely the sentence unless anal intercourse was involved, which may explain why the women’s sentences were fairly lenient. Furthermore, all the cases that went to trial involved some sort of public nuisance beyond simple sexual behavior. There may also have been personal discretion on the part of individual prosecutors whether they chose to pursue women under the sodomy statute. After the French invasion of 1795 there was a period of increased prosecution of same-sex acts which seems to have been driven by the zeal of a specific official. Another aspect of the distribution of prosecutions was the large proportion of women’s charges that were for moral offenses, with a substantial increase in the last decade of the 18th century. These were frequently driven by the request of family or community that a person be confined for “immoral behavior” that was felt to be disruptive.
This increased focus on the role of individual morality in the context of social welfare and good citizenship was occurring throughout western Europe at the end of the 18th century. For men, the pressure was to avoid the appearance of effeminacy, for women, to avoid any association with prostitution. Because of the popular association of tribadism with prostitution, it came in for scrutiny as a general marker of immorality.
Lesbian Identity?
The final part of the article considers whether any of the court cases provide evidence for the existence of something recognizable as a “lesbian identity” in the modern sense, proposing a genealogy rooted separately in the traditions of romantic friendship and female transvestism that then developed a stage of butch/femme roles in the 19th century and eventually produced the modern lesbian identity. [Note: I’m going to go ahead and say that I think this is a flawed question to begin with and assumes a linear and teleological development of modern identity.]
The romantic friendship tradition in the Netherlands is represented by authors Betje Wolff and Aagje Deken who lived together in the last quarter of the 18th century and also courted other women both before and during their cohabitation. They were not perceived as having a sexual relationship or having any conceptual connection to the sort of women being prosecuted for tribadism. (The zealous prosecutor of the 1790s was a personal friend of theirs.)
The article also points to the long tradition of female cross-dressers documented by Dekker and van de Pol. But van der Meer accepts the claim of those authors that cross-dressing women who engaged in relationships with other women would necessarily have perceived themselves to be “male” and that this could only be considered a precursor to the development of a concept of lesbianism, rather than a type of lesbian identity itself. [Note: Van der Meer doesn't seem to consider the parallel question of the development of a concept of transgender identity.]
But the women being prosecuted in the 18th century don’t fit neatly into either the romantic friendship tradition nor the cross-dressing tradition. Van der Meer suggests that this third tradition should be considered: one organized around generalized lewd behavior and association with prostitution. He compares the interpretations of Faderman and Trumbach with regard to the various factors at play around 1800, and with regard to women’s sexual identities, and leans toward a suggestion that if the sexual component of lesbian identity is considered the most important, above romantic bonds or butch/femme-type partnerships, then his “third category” may be the actual true precursor for modern lesbian identity. [Note: there are so many flaws in this line of reasoning I hardly know where to start, so I’ll just end.]
(Originally aired 2018/12/08 - listen here)
Heather Rose Jones: This month the Lesbian Historic Motif Podcast welcomes author Carrie Pack. Hi, Carrie.
Carrie Pack: Hi, nice to be here.
H: Carrie's YA novel Grrrls on the Side raises the question: Just how do we define historical fiction? I want to explore that a bit later in the podcast, but for now, why don't you tell us a bit about the book?
C: Sure, Grrrls on the Side is actually kind of, well, it takes place during the ‘90s during the Riot Grrrl movement so if anybody's familiar with that particular wave of feminism, these girls are very into their punk music, and their zines, and their feminist ideals. The main character, Tabitha, of course, kind of falls in love a couple times over the course of the book and discovering her own identity as a bisexual woman and an understanding kind of what that means for her, so it's a coming-of-age story and, apparently, the ‘90s are historical. [Laughter]
H: Yeah, so that's an interesting question of categories. You'd said that when we first talked that because it's set in the 90s for a YA market, that's considered historical. Is that because it’s history in terms of the target readership or history because you had to research it as history?
C: Predominantly, the first part of that. I lived it. I mean I was a – my main character is only a year older than me, so I was very familiar with. I mean I used descriptions of the lockers in the locker room of the gym of my high school, but my publisher was the one that said, “Well, this is historical YA,” and I was like, “Historical? It's the 90s.” I mean when someone calls your own high school experience, “historical,” I mean it just, you kind of go, “Oh, gosh, I didn't realize I'd gotten old.”
H: Yeah, I had that experience with another recent interview where the author was saying, “Well, this is set in the ‘70s, so it's really historical,” and I think it's like, “Oh, my god, that's me. That was my college years,” like, “What do you mean?”
C: Right, absolutely, and I think when we're talking about YA, it's kind of like you need to view it like classic cars, like anything over 20 to 25 years ago is considered a classic because if you're talking specifically about teenagers, they weren't even alive; it is historical to them so, yeah, I mean when you classify it that way – my book also got cross categorized though as women's fiction because there's a whole, you know, a lot of the people that I or my contemporaries definitely were very into it because they remember the time period. But, in general, when you talk about publishing, “historical” tends to be anything from pre-mid-century so like you're talking World War II or earlier, so it kind of just depends.
H: Because my personal definition is it's not historical if I was alive.
C: [Laughter] I think that's all of us which is probably why in YA it goes that way. I mean I did have to do some research, so it's not like I didn't do any, but, again, when you've lived the experience, it's a little easier to draw from your own personal. Since with Grrrls on the Side, I basically was giving myself a do-over. I didn’t know that I was bisexual until I was 35, so I didn't get to live my high school years as an out queer person. I didn't know it was an identity that I could have although I knew I wasn't a lesbian, you know what I mean? Like, I knew enough to know that, but I couldn't figure out why, why am I attracted to my female friends? [Laughter] But, because I was also attracted to boys my age, I thought, “Well, obviously, I'm not gay,” and that was the only two options that I knew of. I obviously wanted to give Tabitha her own experience that I didn't get to have.
H: Well, thinking about that and thinking about it as historical fiction because, okay, this is me as an old person talking, but you know it seems like sexuality and identity culture just changes minute-to-minute these days.
C: Oh, yeah.
H: The 90s are a different country in terms of kids these days, but so was it a challenge to try to represent the experience of sexuality in the 90s in a way that would both be true to the era and make sense to today's readers?
C: Oh, absolutely, absolutely, because any time you're writing historical, I think it's a good idea to remember that even though you're writing about a time period in the past, you're still writing for a contemporary audience so while there are things that might have occurred in that time period that at that time were widely accepted, we know in a modern society they're not. That covers everything from if you're writing historical and using the n-word to… or like what I had to do which was--and this is really minor for most of us--but for a modern audience, I had the word, you know when I was a kid there was a lot of, “Oh, that's lame,” but I had someone point out to me that that was ableist language. Now, for me, that's still something that I say and I feel in knowing that now I try to control it but that it could be construed as offensive among modern audiences, so I went back and took that out, but would a girl in the 90s have said that? Well, yeah –
H: Absolutely.
C: She absolutely would have and so I mean it's not – I don't want to ever tell anyone, “Oh, you can't write that,” but I think it's important to consider as a modern sensibility when you're, or a contemporary sensibility I guess I should say, when you're writing historically because there's language that would have been historically accurate, and then there's language that's just harmful. You can still be historically accurate enough without using modern language that wouldn't necessarily been have used in that period. Like, for example, I had someone ask me very early on if I was going to address trans issues because that was [Cross-talk].
H: Yeah, that's what I was just about to bring up. It’s another minefield where the attitudes and the language and just the understanding has changed so radically in the last couple decades.
C: Oh, absolutely, and someone asked me if I was going to address that and I said I didn't want to because it was such a different time even the terminology was different, but what I did do was put in some subtle contextual things about gender identity. Because I was really wanting to focus on the bisexuality aspect of it, I wanted to give examples of different expressions of that, and I have one girl who is very much equally interested in all genders. She does not really, you know, she falls for the person, she falls for the person, so in modern terms, she might refer to herself – she might even choose pansexual, maybe, even though I think bisexual still covers that, but she might choose that whereas I had another character who was probably more demisexual when it comes to women but also use the term “bisexual.” She definitely had to have a connection with a woman, but she certainly could appreciate and would not rule out a relationship with a woman but predominantly attracted to men. Then my main character Tabitha who’s predominantly attracted to women and only incidentally, occasionally, kind of would find herself interested in a guy, so I wanted to give those representations and also wanted to explore gender identity.
One of the girls is very, very feminine and another character is a little more butch and the kind of – I don’t want to say “struggles.” They don't really struggle with it, but the criticism they would get from their friends about that, the one girl being so hyper feminine, and wearing nail polish, and makeup, and, “Oh, you can't possibly be queer,” and the other one being butch, “You're too masculine,” and so those kinds of conversations were had, but, yeah, it's not – for me, I didn't know that I didn't think that I could do it authentically and in a way that wouldn't also be harmful to the trans community.
H: Yeah, yeah, that is a consideration. The issue of identities and how we talk about those identities, like you were talking about, yeah, well, bisexual versus pansexual. It means different things to different people. I know that in you talking about your own podcast, so you have a podcast called Bi Sci-Fi, and one of the things you first said to me when you talked about it was, “Well, it's not just bi, and it's not just sci-fi.”
C: Yeah.
H: And, I have that same thing with my podcast because I've got the word lesbian emblazoned over everything because for me it's a good brand, but I always make it very clear that I'm not talking about the narrow definition of lesbian. I am using that to stand in for, you know, women whose primary emotional and romantic relationships are oriented towards other women within the context of the story that I'm talking about, but it’s way too wordy.
C: Right.
H: So, thinking about that kind of – I don't want to say “labeling” because that brings up a different way of thinking about it but “branding,” thinking about branding and what are the difficulties you have in using bi as a brand on your podcast and trying to communicate that you have a broader interest?
C: I mean I think you kind of said it. I think exactly what you said which is you have to kind of give the short description and then a long description. Ultimately, it came down to a branding thing for me. I had a Twitter chat that I'd started with a group of friends that was called Bi Sci-Fi because we all identify, I think almost all the authors identified as bisexual and or had main characters in our novels that were bisexual, and so we had started a Twitter chat. Bi Sci-Fi was a great… you know, it's a rhyme first of all.
H: It rhymes. [Laughter]
C: Yeah, and I had been forever trying to come up with an idea for a podcast. I just felt like I don't know what I would want to talk about. I don't know, and I just realized I had such an interest in speculative fiction in general. I kept the brand that I already had going, and I identify as bisexual, so it worked for me and also Queer Sci-Fi was taken so [Laughter] yeah, yeah, Scott Coatsworth and Angel Martinez have a wonderful…
H: Yes, I’m part of the Facebook group for that.
C: Yeah, absolutely, they have a Facebook group. They have a wonderful blog and online presence, and it's great branding, but I can't steal their name. Then there's nothing, you can’t like, “Queer Spec Fic,” you know, it doesn't roll off the tongue so, yes, there's always the long explanation. What I always say is that it's queer positive speculative fiction. If the author is an ally, if they write and they write spec fic, if the author identifies as queer and write spec fic, if the characters are queer and in the spec fic, I will cover it because I think that, for me, the biggest draw to speculative fiction of all kinds is the possibility for everything and nothing to exist at once. If you identify as agender, or trans, or gay, or just identify as queer, there is a place for you in that realm of fiction. The long and short of it is that I wanted to keep my branding from the chat, and it was a catchier name but that I’d always have to explain this, always. [Laughter]
H: So, what do you envision as the scope of your show? Why don't you talk about it a little bit?
C: Yeah, sure, right now it's mostly just me and other authors chatting about what we write and what we read, but I hope to, eventually, also have fans come on and talk about what they love and things that they're doing. I had someone message me wanting to talk about the new Doctor Who because now that the Doctor is a woman that canonically makes her pansexual or bisexual so that opens up a whole new realm. The Doctor is married to a woman and has been multiple times in canon, so I think that, for me, is – I want to explore how fans look at other spec fic, and I'd like people to come on and talk about movies and television as well, comics and things like that. Right now, it's really geared toward the written word, towards fiction, but that doesn't mean that I won't go there in the future but, for right now, it's a lot of authors talking about what they write and why they write it, and how that reflects our ideal, I think, of what queer fiction should be.
H: So, you’ve written both the, whether you want to call it contemporary historical for Grrrls on the Side, but also you've written a pair of speculative books, I know.
C: Right.
H: I think one of them is just about to come out or just came out or…?
C: Came out in August, yeah.
H: Okay, yeah, and I was interested in what's your experience of the different flavors of the book world between speculative fiction and realistic fiction?
C: In my experience, this is my personal experience, I don't want to say that this is necessarily a universality but that I found it harder to kind of break into adult speculative fiction than it was in any place in YA. The YA community was much more welcoming to my book. Now, I don't know. That could simply be the way that it was pitched, the way that it was marketed. I couldn't even tell you but so, for me, that's kind of where I found the difference to be, and I think because even though it is technically, like we were talking about it being historical, it's contemporary historical. It's more modern, and there's not the elements of speculation on top of it whereas my other, that duology is time travel. Both have won awards, both the historical contemporary and the time travel, but the YA book sold a lot better. I don't know if one market is clamoring more for the FF YA because that's certainly a place where – the YA community is, right now, very, very into their women loving women stories so that could be it, too. I don't know. That's been my experience, but both technically are contemporary. I mean they both, again, one is contemporary historical and the other one is contemporary science fiction, but they take place in very modern contemporary societies.
H: So, what was it like to research this book? I mean I know you said that it represents your life to some extent, but what parts of it did you have to research?
C: I mean the easiest stuff was, of course, looking into music and looking into my cultural references in the time period, but I think my favorite thing that I had to look into was and writing these zines from the point of views of characters who are having these, basically, if you've never read a zine especially ones from the 90s very much like just screed about whatever the writer wanted to rant about. There's one that is actually my favorite segment that I wrote in the whole book, and it's called “Of Mice and Menses” and my character is ranting about how her period has been commodified. In other words, it's the idea that she menstruates every month is both asexual and hyper sexualized, and she has to pay for these things that she doesn't understand and are obviously created by men, and I had to look up when wings were put on maxi pads.
H: [Laughter] Oh, my god, I'm thinking of the entire history of experimental menstrual products that I lived through.
C: Right? This is a generation that, thank God, did not have to deal with the sanitary belt, right? Although I am very familiar because my mom obviously dealt with that, and just a variety of different things and the horror of reading the packaging on tampons and worrying about toxic shock syndrome, but the thing for me that's always been baffling is the wing on a maxi pad. It serves no purpose. It does not keep it from leaking. All it does is get caught in your pubic hair and stick to your thighs, pardon my bluntness, especially if you don't have a thigh gap, that thing is just going to stick to things. So, literally, that's what my character is venting about, but I did have to look it up, and, thankfully, they were added to pads in the 80s so I was not like – I was pretty sure that I remembered them being on pads when I was a teenager, but I couldn't be sure, so I had to look it up and it was sometime in the 80s. Obviously, that was invented by a man, obviously, someone who had never worn a maxi pad in their lives.
H: [Laughter] Anything else you had to research in that way to get the details right, the realism?
C: Well, the most fun, I think, was getting to read old zines. There's a book called, I believe it's called The Riot Grrrl Collection. I'm trying to see if I can see it on my shelves here, but it's literally a collection of zines that has been compiled. It's everything from some of the more famous ones like Bikini Kill and those very early Riot Grrrl zines to some obscure ones. There's some in there from black women and other people of color, and all of the elements of that. For me, that was the most fun was going back through and reliving it through that… first-person historical accounts is essentially what you're reading.
H: It's sort of proto-blogging in a way.
C: Mm-hmm. Oh, yeah, yeah, when I explained what zines are to teenagers and young adults, I teach college right now, and so my students weren't alive. They were born in ’95, ’96. When I talked to them about it, I always say, “Well, it's blogging, but it was before the internet was wide enough spread that people blogged, pretty much.” It was the bridge between journaling and blogging, and so, yes, photocopying your clip together magazine pieces and type or handwritten journal entries and things like that. It's fun to read these young women, and it was mostly driven by young people, young people in the punk scene were the forefront of these zines. I mean zines have a longer history than that, of course.
H: Yeah, fan zines in the science fiction community, yeah.
C: Absolutely, going all the way back to the original Star Trek series, and maybe even prior to that, but to see, again, it's like if you're researching past presidents and you pull out their letters and you can go find letters from Thomas Jefferson and his journal entries, and things like that. It's the same thing but instead of it being about the day to days of a politician, it's about the day to day of a teenage girl. It's amazing. One of the best, as a matter-of-fact the epigraph of my book is a quote from a book about Riot Grrrl. It is, “The 90s were a rough time to be a girl,” I'm paraphrasing here but, “so little has changed,” and it's true.
That's one of the reasons I wanted to write this book is that, yeah, that was 20 years ago, but you would be surprised how little has changed in that intervening time for young women to be… they’re taunted, they’re oversexualized, they’re infantilized, and treated like their opinions are the bottom of the barrel. It's always like, “Oh, yeah, some teenage girls.” I mean we saw it with Taylor Swift. She voices her political opinion and there's other issues with that, but the primary thing that people were pointing out was like, and I think there was – who was the politician that was like, “Oh, well, 13-year-old girls can't vote.” Her fans aren't 13, and that's not an insult. 13-year-old girls are allowed to have opinions.
H: Yeah, any other projects that you're working on currently that you are able and willing to talk about?
C: Well, I'm still trying to finish up a contemporary horror novella, but, in the back of my mind, I do have another historical I wanna conquer. Back in my recent fandom past, I wrote a historical M/M for a fandom that I was in and what sparked it was it takes place during the Gilded Age which is basically the late Victorian period but in America, and what I love about that society was how easy – and this is the time period where Oscar Wilde was at his peak of his running around Europe, looking at the way society was structured was that men socialize with men and women socialize with women, and you only were really with the opposite sex once you were married, and how easy that really was for gay, lesbian, and bisexual individuals to have relationships, have companionships with same gendered genders.
H: Oh, yeah, I am constantly trying to impress this upon my listeners and my blog readers that you don't have to go through shenanigans to get your two same-sex people together because that would be the norm of life for them.
C: Absolutely, it would not be – and one of the reasons why Oscar Wilde was ever “caught” was kind of because a noble had kind of a personal vendetta, but, otherwise, it was not rare that, you know, no one thought twice about him hanging out with young men all the time. Also, they didn't have, the way we do in contemporary society that view of homosexuality. It wasn't defined, so it wasn't really – if you had a gay uncle, it was just kind of like, “Oh, well, he's just that way,” and really was just we just don’t talk about it.
H: A confirmed bachelor.
C: A confirmed bachelor, absolutely. [Laughter] My mom tells a great story from when she lived with, I think probably in the 60s, and they had neighbors down the street who she called, “the bachelors,” and she didn’t realize until many years later that they were a gay couple because, again, it was a don't-ask-don't-tell kind of thing, and we just didn't talk about it. There were quite a few young men and young women who engaged in these kinds of relationships. So, I kind of was thinking I wanted to maybe make it a two-parter of a gay couple and a lesbian couple, kind of having that opportunity to explore these relationships because of the structure of society and how that was not noticed as an impropriety because they were forced into these same-sex social groups. So, that's my dream project. [Laughter]
H: If you get around to writing the lesbian couple, drop me a note. Let me know.
C: Definitely, definitely.
H: So, other than your podcast which I will put the links to in the show notes, where can listeners find you online?
C: Sure, the easiest way probably is I'm on Twitter. I'm @carriepack on Twitter, and that's probably the easiest way because it's a good direct communication, but, basically, I'm on all social media so anywhere you can find a person named Carrie Pack, it’s likely me, likely. [Laughter] There are others out there. They're scientists though. They're much cooler than me.
H: Yeah, I think I found a website for you as well, probably linked from your Twitter, so I'll put links to all of that in the show notes. Thank you so much, Carrie, for joining us this month.
C: Thank you.
A series of interviews with authors of historically-based fiction featuring queer women.
In this episode we talk about
Links to the Lesbian Historic Motif Project Online
Links to Heather Online
Links to Carrie Pack Online